Did Muhammad Exist?, will be released on April 23rd. Although I haven't read the book yet, I suspect that I'll agree with most (or all) of the facts Robert presents, but that I will radically disagree with his conclusion. Since Robert and I will both be in Michigan for the Jessica Mokdad Human Rights Conference on April 29th, it seems we have an excellent opportunity for a little "in house" debate. Muslims of the world, prepare to thank me for defending your prophet's existence. (Afterwards, however, if you see me coming, better step aside, because I'm coming for your prophet.)
***UPDATE*** Robert accepted the challenge. We're on for the 29th!
I love the glove LOL. I heard Robert say that Mohammad probably existed.
Once again the Islamaphobic Kuffars have to defend Islam.
I hereby announce that I love this video.
This should be really good!!! I've been waiting on Roberts book to come out because frankly I was thrown for a loop the first time I heard him say it is possible that MO never existed. I thought,, how the hell could that be. While I am open to hear his arguments I remain very skeptical.
DAVID: Maybe you should ask Robert for a PDF copy of the book so you can be on top of the arguments and have the best response possible together.
Allot of us cannot make it to the conference for Jessica,, if ABN shows this live, it will be like we are there a little. I AM LOOKING FORWARD TO THIS!!!
“The Reformed apologist throws down the gauntlet and challenges his opponent to a duel-to-the-death.” - Cornelius Van Til.
hahaha priceless. David Wood hero of Islam.
My understanding is that Spencer believes that Mohammed "probably" existed, there is a "historical core", but it's probably highly embellished.
Similar to how many Historians view Jesus pretty much. They believe there was a historical core but Christianity exaggerates and embellishes much of it.
If you do take on this debate will you be saying, "Peace be unto him" after each mention of Muhammad's name, just for a day of course? And will you be growing a beard for full effect? I noticed the beginnings of one on the video clip. Just asking.
Way to go guys! This is gonna be rip-roaring fun...
I am not sure how you thing, because quite honestly, I've never been in an infidel's shoes. I mean, here is a guy whom you seem to uphold dearly who basically thinks Jesus Christ, peace be upon him, is illegitimate; that he is a bastard, a son of a man and a woman, that his mother slept with another man and had him. I read that his man was a Roman solider whom Mary, peace be upon her, supposedly slept with and got pregnant from and had Jesus.
I really would like to see you debate one of your Jewish beloveds on who is Jesus Christ to them. Because otherwise why would they call themselves Jews and not Christians??? I know they'll give you the ordinary Jewish BS of we believe he is a Rabbie. A Rabbie is a teacher, and anyone can be called that, even a false liar. I believe they rely on the Bible's "false teachers" quotes to attribute this title to Jesus. In other words, "My brother David Wood, we believe Jesus is a (false) Rabbie." This is the kind of quote they'd give you. I am not sure what kind of a "brother" are you to him or them when they DIRECTLy falsify your Christ!
So, are you courageous enough to do this?
Great to see another soliloquy from David. He is great to watch.
What idiot would argue that Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him, didn't exist?
I can see how Jesus or any of the OT Prophets can be argued to have never existed, since all we have is a Bible to prove their existence. But the Prophet of Islam's existence has far more proofs outside the Islamic texts. THE LAST TIME THE PRIME MINISTER of Italy visited Syria, he visited the grave of Khalid Bin Walid and SALUTED HIM (I saw it on Al-Jazeera few months ago), the Muslim leader who was titled as THE SWORD OF ALLAH (Saifullah) by the Prophet of Islam, and who dealt the Romans 13 defeats which caused them to retreive back to Rome and costed them the entire Middle East and even North Africa. The same leader by the way dealt several defeats to the Persians before the Persia fell on the last battle of Al-Qaadisiyyah which was led by the Muslim leader, Sa'ad bin Abiwaqqaas.
The point I making here is that BOTH THE IRANIAN AND ROMAN HISTORY BOOKS TESTIFY TO THE MUSLIM LEADERS who fought them! These leaders were companions and desciples of Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon and them. So, the prime minister of Italy, for instance, knew EXACTLY who was Khalid Bin Walid! He is the one who finished off the Roman Empire and shrunk it to never-stand-up-ever-again forever! And he is the same leader who caused for Persia to fall, also forever! These men existed during the days of the Prophet. So we have AMPLE SOURCES OUTSIDE EVEN ARABIA that prove that Prophet Muhammad existed.
Sorry, not few months ago. My memory is failing me :). It was I believe more than a 1 1/2 ago. But I most certainly saw it on Aljazeera where the Italian Prime Minister went to Khalid Bin Waleed's grave and saluted him, and even called him "General Khalid Bin Waleed".
"I mean, here is a guy whom you seem to uphold dearly who basically thinks Jesus Christ, peace be upon him, is illegitimate;"
What the hell are you talking about Osama? Who believes this? Spencer? Woods? I don't believe either believe this.
I hate to break it to you Osma but Robert Spencer is Catholic lol
Good grief !
Someone put Osama back in his box before he hurts himself.
And what's even more ludicrous is that Robert Spencer is Iranian!! His country has detailed books on the history of Persia's fall! He couldn't possibly be serious in his claim that Prophet Muhammad never existed.
Osama said: "My memory is failing me :)"...
I think it is more than just the memory failing you. It is your God given brain that you are letting it failing you. Reasons why:
- You are calling a pedophile -> the best example to follow.
- You call a book filled with violence and teachings that even animals would find monstrous -> a noble book
- You call the Allah found in your not noble book -> a great god (what's so great about being the greates deceiver? what's so great about putting the sins of moooooslims upon christians and jews? what's so great about being muuuhahaMAD's puppet ?)
- You call Aisha the mother of the believers,(i know it's a metaphoric name, but i have a point ) when she herself was never a mother because the pedophile that lied her father most likely ripped(destroyed) her "vagina" by having sex with her when she was a child (for goodness sake she was still playing with dolls when she was taken... her hair fell of because of the trauma she suffered ).
- You call heaven what every sane woman would call a RAPE HOUSE.
- You call blameless (sinless) prophet a man that any jury would find guilty for RAPE, PEDOPHILIA, NECROPHILIA, MURDER, EXTORTION, THEFT, LYING, PROMOTING VIOLENCE etc...
WAKE UP Osama, and let your brain think...wake up before you become more like your hero...
Uh-oh. Someone better contact homeland security. It looks as if Osama Abdullah is reaching critical mass.
......any day now folks....he could go full blown muslim.
The Krazy seems to be seeping through.
Wow, three posts in arow, and yet you can't bother to post a reply to me in older topics when i confront you about your bad behavior towards me (your slandering me by saying I want hate crimes against Muslims to happen only because I don't beleive they happen all that often, and citing a report that says so), or your dishonest misuse of Scripture (song of Solmon, 1 Chron 5:5, etc.).
Oops, that's the sound of Osama running away once again. The Osama has left the building!
"......any day now folks....he could go full blown muslim. "
That was pretty funny!
Interesting. Love the video.
Can't wait to view the debate. =D
"Uh-oh. Someone better contact homeland security. It looks as if Osama Abdullah is reaching critical mass."
I have just replaced my computer's keyboard with a new one. How did you know that I was reaching a critical mass???
"Islam needs a hero, I'll be that hero.... your champion has arrived!... David Wood [is] Islam's champion for a day."
I LOL'd. Seriously....
I agree with you at this point, primarily because I studied various approaches to Islamic historiography in UofT and found that the hyper-skeptical approach is just a rehashed version of the stuff used against Christians, being redirected at Muslims. For consistency's sake, it's better to use the same standard when using both faiths (a novel idea for the Muslims, I know).
Isn't this a bit of braggadocio here?
Whoever wins the debate, surely the loser is Islam.
"Islam needs a hero, I'll be that hero.... your champion has arrived!... David Wood [is] Islam's champion for a day."
Please try to show some respect. More to the topic though. What is Robert's position on this? I always thought that Robert tended toward believing in the existence of the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh).
In you first post I understood you meant a Jew.But I didn't undestand what that had to do with the debate.
Now I understand you meant Spencer is Jewish.Spencer has said his family was from Turkey but Christian,I believe he is Greek Catholic.
Unless you think Spencer is really Jewish and hiding it.
how do you know you are not imagining things ?
Osama: Not running away, but just ignoring me? WELL?
You better be careful. Robert might decide to "pull an Osama" at the very last minute. Ya know, decide not to show up because he's too retarded to figure out airplane travel.
Just giving you a heads up.
Also, where does one actually get a gauntlet these days.
Samatar said: "Please try to show some respect."
I'm offended by this comment.
Show some respect when you are on this blog, and when you know the West value freedom of speech and thought.
@andy: Sorry, but this seems completely uneccery. I understand you're making of Osama, but Mr. Spencer is nothing at all like Osama.
Samatar said: "What is Robert's position on this? I always thought that Robert tended toward believing in the existence of the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh)."
In this video, Robert explains his findings:
" ...when you know the West value freedom of speech and thought."
Im not forcing David to be respectful and I understand he has the right to say what he is saying. But that doesn't mean that I shouldn't point out when he is being disrespectful. I expected a comment like that from Sam shamoun rather than David Wood.
This is wonderful! Two great leaders showing the Islamic world how it (God-given human reasonable thought) is done.
Samatar Mohamed said..."Please try to show some respect. More to the topic though. What is Robert's position on this? I always thought that Robert tended toward believing in the existence of the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh)."
The irony is that David will be giving Islam more respect than the average Muslim apologist by actually demonstrating logic and good argumentation.
April 18, 2012 11:16 PM
MAY THE PEACE OF THE LORD BE WITH US ALL. AMEN.
@ prof. Oasama Buffoon Abdullah,
I think honestly that the level of this argument isn't yours so please just keep silent in your little corner. It is shameful for all of you muslims not to come up with someone to debate Mr. Robert. Please take your time and listen carefully to the video. Dr. David is telling you that you aren't capable of defending your prophet therefore he will do it for you, and also he wants to show the way you'd behave.
Anyway I understand your position, since even your allah doesn't know that much. It is only the quran that I came across a god using the word maybe or perhaps. Well I know you will tell me that I do not know arabic. Sura 15 first word of aya 2. Therefore do not worry just wish Dr. David good luck. Mind you they (Dr. David and Mr. Robert) are not going to fight or throw stones at each other maybe (as allah said) you' re thinking they will be there with stones. Christians talk.
BTW in which well with the sun set today prof. Osama BUFFOON Abdullah? I'd like to go and see it as "dhul karne" did please?
Brethren MAY THE LORD YAHWEH BE WITH US ALWAYS IN THE HOLY PRECIOUS NAME OF JESUS AMEN
You know a good way to prove Muhammads existence? If he ever died, then he certainly was alive at one point. If he had a multiply attested death so embarassing that muslims would never invent it, it would be pretty much guaranteed he died, and thus lived. Although i bet you already know what youre doing.
Foolster 41: Google ironic humour.
Are you American by any chance?
Osama said: I can see how Jesus or any of the OT Prophets can be argued to have never existed, since all we have is a Bible to prove their existence.
Now I know you don’t really mean that Osama, to say the least we’re talking about someone whose mentioned more in the Quran than your own beloved Mohammad.
Samatar said: "Please try to show some respect."
Oh the irony! I make a video pointing out that when someone comes after Muhammad, all Muslims can do nowadays is whine. And Samatar responds with . . . whining!
Actually David, your criteria on whining is based on muslims engaging in this type of behavior when another person critisizes Islam. You on the other hand are arguing for the existence of the prophet Muhammad (pbuh). I am just asking you to show some respect. Wouldn't you ask the same thing if for example Dr.Shabir Ally was going to debate the existence of Jesus (pbuh), while saying that Christianity needs a hero, and he ( a muslim) is willing to be that hero. You would not like muslims approaching your religion in this bravado manner of being the christian saviour and such. So please, do unto others as you would have them do unto you. At the end of the day however, you can do whatever you want to do.
Thanks Billy for the video. So Robert holds that the prophet (pbuh) did not actually exist. I'd like to see his reasons in the upcoming debate against David Wood.
Your supposed parallel is inaccurate. Let's modify it a bit.
Suppose atheists were attacking the existence of Jesus, and Christians responded by calling the atheists "Christianophobes," but we refused to take them on in public debate. After seeing Christians cower in fear, Shabir Ally then stepped in and rebuked the Christians for their cowardice and said, "Christians need a hero, I'll be that hero."
In such a scenario, Shabir would be entirely justified in saying this, and I wouldn't dare sit around whining about his comment, when I should be focussing on the cowardice of the Christians who refused to defend our Lord.
Fortunately, no such situation exists for our side. Christians are quite happy taking on atheists, agnostics, Muslims, and anyone else who challenges our beliefs. Muslims, however, sit around all day moaning and wailing about "Islamophobia," when they could be responding to Robert.
You need a hero, Samatar. I'll be your hero. You can thank me later.
David Wood said,
"You need a hero, Samatar. I'll be your hero. You can thank me later."
How I wish I could 'like' this particular comment like in Facebook. Haha.
David, what you just posted was 50 different kinds of awesome. i now understand why you're doing this
We know that Wood is arrogant. He's not defending the Prophet for the sake of Islam, rather to boost his ego as seen on his video. We believe the Prophet (pbuh) existed no doubt about it and only a fool would say that he didnt.
I don't want to make too much out of this but I do not know what you mean by saying that Muslims refuse to take christians, atheists, etc.. on public debates. Just today Sami Zaatari is having a debate with Michael Nugent on whether religion is relevent to modern society, Shadid Lewis had a debate with Donald Wolan on whether Jesus (pbuh) is God just last week, and Shabir Ally had a debate with Dr. James white just last month as to whether Jesus (pbuh) claimed to be God. Muslim apologists are standing in the public stage making rational arguments for muslims, hence, why I disagree with your position.
Quran verse of the day:
Surah Nahl (16:125)
ٱدۡعُ إِلَىٰ سَبِيلِ رَبِّكَ بِٱلۡحِكۡمَةِ وَٱلۡمَوۡعِظَةِ ٱلۡحَسَنَةِۖ وَجَـٰدِلۡهُم بِٱلَّتِى هِىَ أَحۡسَنُۚ إِنَّ رَبَّكَ هُوَ أَعۡلَمُ بِمَن ضَلَّ عَن سَبِيلِهِۦۖ وَهُوَ أَعۡلَمُ بِٱلۡمُهۡتَدِينَ (١٢٥)
Invite (all) to the way of thy Lord with wisdom and beautiful preaching; and argue with them in ways that are best and most gracious: for thy Lord knoweth, best who have strayed from His Path, and who receive guidance. (125)
Wow, Samatar. You really live in fantasy world, don't you? Sami and Shadid are with MDI, an organization that focuses a good part of their attention on shutting down debates. Of the debaters you listed, only Sami has ever been willing to defend Muhammad's prophethood (so far as I know). And while we have to respect him for agreeing to defend Muhammad, he happens to be one of the youngest debaters in the world.
When was the last time Shabir or one of your more popular debaters defended Muhammad? Never? Shadid just debated the identity of Jesus (against a person I've never heard of). When is Shadid going to debate the identity of Muhammad? Why is it that Ally, Badawi, and Naik focus almost exclusively on Christian topics? Is it because they can't defend Muhammad?
The bottom line is that your most respected debaters (Zakir Naik, Shabir Ally, Jamal Badawi) are terrified of defending your prophet on stage. Why so? If the evidence is clear, why wouldn't they accept our challenges? And when are Naik, Ally, or Badawi going to face Spencer? Never??? Well then, it seems I'll have to face him for you.
I'm glad to be your hero, Samatar.
Kangaroo said: "He's not defending the Prophet for the sake of Islam, rather to boost his ego as seen on his video."
The irony never stops! I point out that Muslims have to resort to childishness and personal attacks when they can't defend their prophet. And Kangaroo responds with a childish personal attack! You couldn't make this stuff up!
This is a comment from Robert Spencer in his blog accepting the debate challenge of David Wood.
"The field of cowardly creeps who have refused to debate me, ignored my challenge, or weaseled out of it in some other way includes such "luminaries" as Suhail Khan, Reza Aslan, Caner K. Dagli, "Danios of Loonwatch," Ahmed Rehab, Omid Safi, and many others."
It proves, you terribly need a hero.
I'm still wondering how is it that Samatar is not imaginings things?
Samatar you still don't get it. Freedom of speech and thought are not merely a western value, but freedom to EXPRESS. Expression includes ridicule, mockery, irony, sarcasm, fun, satire.
Samtar as soon as David made those comments I was laughing out loud. We all know it was intended to be funny and it was very funny.
Why come on this blog and disrespect western values?
Everytime you say "I'm asking him to show respect" you are doing the opposite. You are asking him NOT to speak how HE wants. This is ISLAMIC THEOCRACY on a subtle level and you won't get away with it.
You are a disgrace.
And don't forget you to e-mail me in April for our up coming debate in May.
Shabir Ally is not a part of MDI however and he did just debate Dr. James White on whether Jesus (pbuh) claimed to be God. You said when has one of the popular muslim apologists ever defended the prophet Muhammad (pbuh) in a debate. Well, you did just point out Sami Zaatari, also, Bassam Zawadi had a debate with you a few years ago on whether Islam is true in which he indirectly was defending the prophet Muhammad (pbuh). Also, I heard that Shabir Ally and James White might do a debate on salvation in Islam and Christianity, meaning that Shabir will be defending islam as well as the prophet Muhammad (pbuh) assuming they do the debate. As for Jamal Badawi, he does not debate anymore.
"I'm still wondering how is it that Samatar is not imaginings things?"
You never cease to amaze me.
I don't see how I can make this any more clear. Let me give it one more try. Think about some of Christianity's main debaters. Think about James White and William Lane Craig. They've defended the Deity of Christ over and over again. They've defended Jesus' death and resurrection over and over again. In other words, our main debaters spend quite a bit of time defending Jesus against critics.
Now turn to your main debaters. How much time has Shabir Ally or Zakir Naik spent defending the prophethood of Muhammad against critics? None that I'm aware of. Instead, they try to focus on Christian topics.
So Christian debaters are happy to defend Jesus against anyone who questions our beliefs, while Muslims are terrified of defending Muhammad against critics.
Like it or not, pointing to young debaters like Sami and Bassam doesn't change the fact that your best known debaters won't come anywhere near your prophet. And your attempt to equate a debate on salvation with a debate on the prophethood of Muhammad is simply absurd.
You are cheating :) it's not fair to wear the Churck Norris T-shirt!
1 - Osama said: I can see how Jesus or any of the OT Prophets can be argued to have never existed, since all we have is a Bible to prove their existence.
Are you saying that the Quran is wrong? Since it affirms those prophets as well?
You truly are ignorant. I believe that 4th grade students can easily beat you in a debate 'cause they are more intelligent than you. Seriously!!! You always refute your own prophet and what you're trying to protect without realizing it.
2 - Some people don't understand the purpose of this debate.
Proving Muhammad's existence has nothing to do with whether he was a prophet from God or not.He is still a false prophet.
So I don't see how David is defending Islam.
In fact, how can we say he is a false prophet if he has never existed???
"@Hezekiah" I'm still wondering how is it that Samatar is not imaginings things?" You never cease to amaze me."
I know. So, how is it that you are not?
Glove + Chuck Norris t-shirt... awesome
Having thought about this I think defending Muhammad's legitimacy would educate and encourage Muslims. I challenged a Muslim recently on the "Palestinian" right to the Holy Land. He couldn't make a case from the Koran and went silent after a while. It was left to another non-Muslim and I to debate this. After I posted my final statement the Muslim then came back but only to press us into continuing with our debate.
Your comment is very interesting.In my case Muslims are really obsessed by the Palestinian question.
In all honesty there isn't even a thing as a Palestinian people,it was invented out of thin air,just like the "Jordanians" were invented out of thin air.
Both groups are undeniably Arab and the same thing,no difference.
According to ABN's email advertisement, this debate will be moderated by Michael Coren and there will be a post-debate assessment by Pamela Geller. Very interesting!
"We know that Wood is arrogant. He's not defending the Prophet for the sake of Islam...."
Well DUH ! ! ! No sh!t Sherlock!
Now who in their right minds would defend such an atrocious character, except to argue that this absurd little opportunist did infact exist?
"for the sake of Islam?" hahaha Yeah right! Only brain dead Muslims would ever do that, because when trapped in Islam, one has to forego their ability to think.
If you believe Wood is arrogant, then instead of shooting your mouth off here, why don't YOU take on the challange and let David off the hook?
You should ask Mr. Spencer to explain the sunni/shiite split.
how could there have been a fight between his greedy power crazed heirs and his greedy power crazed followers if he himself, as the nexus between these two groups of greedy power crazed scavangers, did not exist?
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