Friday, April 24, 2009

Answering Muslims: Website FAQ

Our approach to answering Muslims is simple: love the people, hate the lies.

Many people have taken offense to our website, saying it promotes misunderstanding and hatred. This could not be further from the truth. The goal of this website is to point out the truth, thereby clearing up any misunderstandings people may have. The ultimate purpose of this website is to bring people into a loving relationship with each other and with God. So to say that we are promoting misunderstanding and hatred is wrong.

Below are some frequently asked questions, with our answers.

Q: "Why do you try to use scare tactics to keep people away from Islam? It wont work, people are smarter than that!"
A: We are not using scare tactics on this website - we are going straight to the history of Muhammad himself to make our points. We're not going to use pre-filtered, biased material to do that, we're going to use all the earliest, most well attested material we have in our possession. For example, we didn't say "Aisha's goat ate the verse of stoning and other verses out of the Qur'an" without providing a reference to Ibn Majah's Book of Nikah and stating that Umar, Ibn Abbas, and Ubay ibn Ka'ab all attested to the existence of these verses in the Qur'an. We're not about to say that Muhammad hit Aisha and caused her pain without referring to Sahih Muslim #2127. We're not about to say that Muhammad was a victim of black magic without referring to Sahih Bukhari #5432. These are things found in the earliest sources. Is using information from these sources a "scare tactic"?

Q: "Muslim scholars consider your quotations from Islamic history to be weak - why don't you see that?"
A: We do see that - we don't care. People have been biased throughout history. Of course Muslims would say the sources which make Muhammad look good are strong, and the others are weak. This is natural - no need to get defensive. People want to make their prophet look good, even subconsciously. That's why all historians everywhere do the opposite of what Muslim historians do; they take traditions that sound biased and give them less weight, and they take traditions which do not leave any room for bias and give them more weight. That's one reason why we believe that Muhammad thought he was a victim of black magic, that he delivered verses of the Qur'an from Satan, and that he was suicidal when he became a prophet. What Muslim would make these things up? Yet we find all these accounts scattered throughout the earliest sirah literature.

Q: "Why do you put up links to videos of violent or deceptive Muslims? Why not focus on the good ones?"
A: While we love all Muslims, including the loving ones, we certainly detest the actions of the violent and deceptive ones. And we would write those off as being odd cases if it weren't for the fact that most of what they are doing can be found in the person of Muhammad. To take the cake, the "violent" or "deceptive" Muslims often proclaim boldly that Muhammad is the reason for their actions! It behooves all peace-loving and honest people, then, to denounce their actions and the source of their actions.
We don't focus on the love of good Muslims because we have no issue with them. We're not a website called "Praising Muslims" -- we're Answering Muslims, and we're providing an answer to the puzzling conduct of many people out there who are devout Muslims. If we are asked "Why are these Muslims murdering cartoonists/rhetoricians over their portrayals of Muhammad?" we will answer the question: because that's what Muhammad did, according to the earliest Muslim literature.

Q: "But you guys are so full of hate!"
A: No, we're really not. We love Muslims. We continually pray that they will receive the full love of God, that they will come into loving relationships with everyone, and that we will enjoy fellowship throughout eternity. These are the kinds of things Christians have been taught in their scripture to desire for their enemies. Have you ever heard the authors of this website say anything this hateful:

Surely the vilest of animals in God's sight are the non-Muslims.
(Compare with Surah 8:55)

How perverse are the non-Muslims!
(Compare with Surah 9:30)

Those with Muhammad are ruthless against the disbelievers
(Compare with Surah 48:29)

These are hateful attitudes, clearly antithetical to the ones Christians have. So if you want to call us hateful and take issue with us, please take issue with Allah for his hatefulness first, which is truly egregious.

Q: "Why do you link to such biased websites?"
A: What, you mean the Muslim websites? We link to Muslim websites because we want to be fair and honest. We're one of the few Muslim-Christian dialogue sites that link to the opposing side, giving everyone a fair shake. We also are one of the few sites that let them post freely on our comment boards.

Q: "You are Islamophobes!"
A: That's simply not true. David befriended me (Nabeel) while I was still Muslim. I used to be Muslim, and all my relatives and many of my friends are still Muslim. We enjoy the company of Muslims, be they Sunni, Shia, Ahmadi, Qur'an only, etc. We do not discriminate in our love. Thus we are hardly afraid of Islam. We are ready to dive into Islamic history and thought exactly because we are not afraid, but rather willing to get our feet wet in order to share Love and Life with our Muslim friends. Yes, at times the conversations may get heated and frustrations may be vented, but these are the expected difficulties of sharing our faith. We truly harbor no hatred towards anyone, but we are strongly opposed to any falsehood which promotes violence and suppression of civil rights. This is not Islamophobia.

In sum, we love Muslims, and we hate all things that detract from the glory of the One, True God. So we shower our love on Muslims while fighting tooth and nail against all the lies and falsehood that keep them away from loving God. That's our attitude, and that's why we do what we do.

May God bless us all with his love and destroy the shackles that might bind us. May we serve Him with humility and dedication. In Jesus' precious name, amen.

163 comments:

Ree said...

Are you aware of the case of Roohi Tabassum, the Pakistani woman who's about to be sent back to Pakistan where her husband has promised to commit an "honor killing" on her because she's been working as a hairdresser in Canada cutting the hair of both men and women? She's scheduled to be deported on April 28th, I believe it is. This website gives information on who to contact to try to stop this.

Fernando said...

I beelive these wordes wont be beliebed bie any muslime... nevertheless I thinke Doctor Wood or Doctor Nabeel shoulde, iff it's possible, creatte a special icon to bee put inn a proeminent place in the blogg page so this FaQ can be easely acessed to all who reach this blogg...

Sakhr said...

"That they said (in boast), 'We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah'; but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not." 4:157Jews have a bad habit of killing prophets. How do we know if this didn't include Jesus? It wasn't Allah who decieved, but it is us who have decieved ourselves. Thats what humans do. Allah is not at fault.

Sakhr said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
nma said...

Sakhr said...

It wasn't Allah who decieved, but it is us who have decieved ourselves. Thats what humans do. Allah is not at fault.
If Quran is true, it is Allah who deceived the believers. Who else made it appear to believers that
Jesus was crucified? How could a number of belivers deceive themselves if Allah is not involved?
Your argument is a typical and silly muslim way of thinking.

Nabeel Qureshi said...

Sakhr --

What is the point you are trying to make? I would like to be able to engage your thoughts, but they are not clear enough. I can try to respond, but I don't think I'm hitting the nail on the head...

Sakhr said...

I appreciate it Nabeel and I'll try to make it clear.

The Jews knew that Jesus was the messiah yet they didn't want to believe it. They decieved themselves even though the evidence is clear that Jesus performed all these miracles.
They were certain they killed Jesus, but it was made to look like he was killed and crucified.
What I'm trying to say is these jews decieve themselves into thinking they killed Jesus just as they decieved themselves that Jesus wasn't the messiah. Allah was not responsible that these jews decieved themselves.

I hope I made it clearer and I look forward to your take on this.

David Wood said...

How exactly does an entire group of people deceive themselves into thinking that they had someone publicly executed?

Sakhr said...

They refused to recognize Jesus as the messiah. Dispite evidence that Jesus did miraculous signs. They decieved themselves. The same thing could be said when they thought they killed Jesus. They decieved themselves into thinking Jesus died. Allah did not do this.

David Wood said...

Sakhr,

You're missing our point. Let's suppose a group of atheists says, "There is no God." Here you and I would agree that they deceived themselves into believing that there is no God. How did they deceive themselves? By ignoring the evidence.

Now suppose that same group of atheists says, "We just killed a man." If you and I say that they deceived themselves about this, we must ask ourselves "How?" When someone claims to have done something (in this case, claims to have executed a man in broad daylight), we must explain their belief somehow. We can't simply say, "Well, they deceived themselves," because they obviously saw something that convinced them that they had killed a man.

So what did the Jews see that made them believe that they had killed Jesus?

nma said...

Sakhr said...
What I'm trying to say is these jews decieve themselves into thinking they killed Jesus just as they decieved themselves that Jesus wasn't the messiah.Though your argument is wrong, let us suppose that jews who caused the crucifixion of Jesus deceived themselves. If that is the case, what about the Apostles and others who witnessed the crucifixion? Did they deceive themselves? How and why?

It is Allah who made it appear and made it look like Jesus was crucified. What other entity could perform such remarkable and unfounded feats?

You need to read this:

http://www.answering-islam.org/Authors/Wood/deceptive_god.htm

Fernando said...

Dear Sakhr... thankes for your wordes... I juste habe one problem with them: do you beliebe inn whate you are saying or you're juste trying to see iff another boggus argumnent mighte stick?

Juste one point (at the momentt I cann remember at least three objections to your argumenmtation): one thing, I guess, is a mentall decieve due to the lack off will to accept the actions (miracles) thate other (Jesus) has donne creattiang a new internal realittie; another is a mentall decieve due to the will to believe in a action (the crucifixion) oneself (the jews) has not donne creatting a new external realittie...

the first one is called endodecieving; the second is called exodecieving... can you see how the first onne can be possible without the agreement off others (the decieve you saide it's possible), while the seconde cannot be possible without the agreement off others (the crucifixion)...

The Fat Man said...

David Wood said...
How exactly does an entire group of people deceive themselves into thinking that they had someone publicly executed?

I guess the same way muslims have deceived themsleves into believing that the crucifiction and death of jesus never happend based on the quran. :)

nma said...

The Fat Man said...

the crucifixion and death of jesus never happend based on the quran.



Allah knows best because Allah always consults the heavenly copy of Quran!

Sepher Shalom said...

Sakhr: " "That they said (in boast), 'We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah'..." "

That right there is all that is needed to falsify the Quran. No Jew on this planet has ever or would ever boast about killing the Messiah (Christ). This is utter nonsense. Mashiyach is the highest hope of everything Jewish. This would be something akin to a Muslim bragging about killing the Mahdi.

The Quran makes no sense at all. No wonder Muslims are so intent on the need to read Tafseer to understand it.

Dk said...

David i'm genuinely curious is the persistant accusation that we "ignore the evidence" based on your belief in romans 1 or have you actually surveyed the atheists?

As far as I know we inteprete the evidence differently, but to say we "ignore it altogether" might actually itself be the "self-deception" you refer to.

What i'm pointing out here is maybe your analogy is not accurate.

Jesus Is Lord said...

God Bless You Mightily, for Your Boldness in Preaching the Gospel, Love of God, Faith in Jesus Christ, Compassion for your Fellow Man.
I would have a suggestion to make that I believe is a very significant one.
Though I have been withnessing for 40 years to friends, family, strangers, my efforts were impotent, resulting in little to no fruit. The fruit that WAS produced was short term, and possibly left people in a worse state than before as I was producing not converts but "backsliders."
I discovered "Way of the Master" ministry, where the 10 commandments are used in a very respectful manner. (The Lord Jesus being the Master.)

Psalms 19:7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul:
The testimony of the LORD is sure making wise the simple;...

Galatians 3:24,25 "Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.
But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster. KJV

People are brought face to face with the Holy Laws of God, and left with an understanding of the Full Gospel. People, by their own admission, declare themselves to be liars, thieves, blasphemers, and adulterers at heart.
I have since used this approach, and the resulting effectiveness & fruitfulness is astounding and lasting!
Please check out their website, and incorporate it into your presentations. People will be brought face to face with the condition of their souls, and their eternal destiny, and given the hope of eternal life through the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross.
Head knowledge isn't enough but a change of heart resulting in conversion.
Thank you for your ministry.
Aloha & Shalom
Jesus Is Lord

Philocycle said...

I read in an article that you've a lawsuit against the city of Dearborn. Is this correct?
I think this might be true.

It has been asserted that you could of had a booth for $150.
Is this True?
I think this might be true.

It has been asserted that your group claimed "to have spent $50,000 on printed materials". Is this true?
I don't believe this claim.
I'm curious how to follow the actual trial. If there is one.

Philip

William said...

I just watched your video from Arab Fest 2009.

First of all, I respect that you, as Christians, want to have meaningful dialogue with Muslims.

But if I may humbly suggest a few suggestions for your ministry.

- First, do not be so condescending and provocative. From the very title of your video ("sharia in the u.s."), it is obvious that you are looking to get a rise.

While it is true that the Muslims at the booth did, indeed, allow you to video your questions, there is ZERO justification for stepping back and sarcastically saying, "So we can ask questions but we can't record it on video...sounds like DECEPTION TO ME!!!!!!"

Besides being un-Christ-like, pulling inciteful, immature shit like that should only be viewed as needlessly provocative and counter-effective to your goals of establishing dialogue between the Muslim and Christian communities.

- Secondly, the Arab Festival is not an appropriate place to go gangbusters on the "soul-winning wagon," brothers.

In the past, I have incited arguments and asked (honest, even innocent) questions to Muslims who were in large groups. It. Is. Not. Effective.

The comparison stands between your proselytizing and the hypothetical example of a Muslim walking up to a public meeting of Christians.

If a Muslim were to act as foolishly arrogant as you two, I have no doubt that he would (rightfully) receive an equally strong reaction from the Christians present at such a meeting.

May I suggest a humbler route to accomplish your goals....

Develop meaningful, honest relationships with Muslims in your community.

And do this without an agenda.

As you have well-stated, it is not your responsibility to pluck the souls of your Muslim friends from hellfire, brothers.

Invite your Muslim friends over for dinner. Laugh with them. Disagree with them.

But don't pretend that you have ALL the answers. You will be surprised to find that you have much to learn from the hospitality of Arabs in general, and Muslims, in specific.

Feel free to discuss your opposing religious views, and by all means disagree, but for God's sake, don't act like you have all the answers and make complete jackasses out of yourselves.

Be careful, despite your good intentions, that you are not driving a further wedge between Muslim and Christian communities and promoting ignorance and hatred rather than peace, love, and truth.

Arokia Raj said...

Just a suggestion, if u guys find that youtube will block your videos, use mahomettube.com to post your videos.

Brian said...

I get tired of hearing the word Islamaphobic thats so stupid. Should we call muslims Christianaphobic's. All the phobics give me a headache lol muslims just don't want to study the same text they beluieve. I urge my Christian brothers and sisters to learn Bible history and Church history because I want Christians to know what they believe. What is really sad is instead of muslims viewing porn they should use the internet to study what they believe.

Blessings
Pastor Brian

Nabeel Qureshi said...

Philocycle,

Acts 17 has not yet sued any group, nor have we yet started any lawsuit. We did file a complaint with the police AFTER finding out that the security there filed a complaint against replete with abject falsehood.

It sounds like you have our group confused with another.

May God bless you. Sincerely,
-Nabeel

Nabeel Qureshi said...

William--

It seems you have not understood the scope of our ministry. We do sit, discuss, and laugh with our Muslim friends. Why, when we were in London to engage in public debate with the Muslim Debate Initiative, we spent most of those nights laughing and enjoying middle eastern food with the very ones we debated.

It seems you have a very one-sided view of us. I suggest you learn more about people before critiquing them.

It also seems you misunderstood our agenda - Acts 17 ministries neither went to the Arab Fest with the intent to convert people there, nor did we go with the intent to provoke people to anger.

We went with the intent to inform people who read our blogs and watch our videos what arguments Muslims generally propagate and to comment on the veracity of those arguments.

When you're in my shoes, and you've received those arguments for years, and they've been insufficient for years, and they are always driven by propaganda and false information, then you're more than justified in showing others what to watch out for if they are seeking the truth.

The reason that it was recorded instead of simply reported was because recording holds people to their words, and people are less flippant about what they say. They also cannot falsely accuse you of misrepresentation, something which has already happened to me.

We've tried all other routes, and we still pursue ones that are effective. But in order to elucidate the public at large about the false statements made by Muslims in general, we must go the route we are going.

I know you will disagree, but I have said my peace. May the Lord bless you with deep insight and compassion. Sincerely,

-Nabeel

William said...

Sir:

Please know that I do not fault you simply for having theological disagreements with Muslim individuals. However, I do have a problem with extrapolating the misdeeds of a single Muslim or a group of Muslims to all or most Muslims.

Reasoning such as this is not only logically fallacious, it is extremely unbiblical and undeniably islamophobic.

If you seriously cannot see how the mindless material on your website rouses hatred, prejudice, and bigotry against Muslims, I suggest glancing at the ignorant comments posted under your youtube videos for a bit of somber proof.

If your desire is to be thought of as a legitimate forum for serious discussion between Muslims and Christians, then stop the stereotyping, ban the bigotry, and drop the Islamic terror counter.

Otherwise, you will only continue to be regarded as a hate blog by any rationally minded individual honestly seeking the truth.

Nabeel Qureshi said...

William--

I do not extrapolate the actions of a single Muslim or a group of Muslims to all Muslims, but I do point out that their actions are often related to the teachings of Islam.

Islam is more than just a set of beliefs; it is also a state with its own system of laws, i.e. Sharia. Often these teachings and laws find themselves at the causal end of mass murder and human rights violations. We simply point out when the atrocities are linked to Islam.

Again, you seem to think we're attacking people here. You're wrong. We're fighting against falsehood and an oppressive ideology. I don't attack Muslims; Muslims are victims of Islam far more than any non-Muslims, even the dead ones.

As for the people who comment on this blog (and on our videos), I stifle their speech no more than I stifle the speech of Muslims on our blog. The comments on many of our videos were getting out of hand, so I stopped allowing comments to be posted. But for you to extrapolate our intentions from the statements of our commenters, well, that just makes you fall guilty to your own criticism against us.

I hope you will come to see clearly what's actually happening here. Sincerely,
-Nabeel

William said...

I agree that comments are not necessarily reflective of the author's material, however in this case I fail to see how the two can be separated, given your consistently one-sided, incessantly negative, extremely inflammatory content which provides so ready and stable a platform for such behavior.

And again, I have been where you are at. I realize that you very well may have good intentions. But I challenge you to re-examine the results of your labor, brothers.

Your goal may not be conversion, though every debate, video, and street fight suggests otherwise.

You may not explicitly say that all Muslims are inherently violent or supportive of violence; but with every single post you imply it.

You may love Muslims, but you are more than willing to endlessly demonize and slander ones whom you know little to nothing of by posting any news article that portrays Muslims in a negative light.

Enough hatred and misunderstanding already exists in this world without your blatantly irresponsible behavior fueling the fire.

Do us all a favor and consider toning down the level of your rhetoric by several dozen notches.

Orkaney said...

Reading through the latest blog entries I ponder a bit. What is required and accepted as proof for the miracles of Jesus, for his actions or what contemporary Jews did to him for that matter? The reason I ask is because I a while ago spent around 6 months failing to find a single shred of evidence for even his existence despite Christians having had 1900 years to provide it. All I found were heaps of forgeries and fakes.

Viewing all the contradictions in the Bibles new testament, adding a totally missing main character to the picture, I feel the Bibles new testament to be a lie altogether, just a collection of wishful thinking. With this in mind, then reading about Mohammeds walks, his war waging, his personal actions, the Quran, how can the Quran even be true?

How I see it. While in Mecca, Mohammed starts preaching his newly found revelations. I'd guess it was amusing to the public at first. Being a good speaker, he slowly but surely attracts followers. As his hoard grows larger, he begins demanding privileges. His croud eventually becomes big enough to pose a threat to the rest of the town so they're thrown out. To put things short, he returns a few years later with a large army, surrounds Mecca and demands that everyone converts. As a good comparison, Adolph Hitler was also a great speaker. He believed in a god, he waged wars, he wrote his book, Mein Kampf and he followed it. Only, Hitler didn't succeed in conquering the known world.

One of my best friends is a Muslim. We join in almost daily walks, discussing business, family, religion, life in general. I worry for him. He's becomming more and more locked in his faith. I fear that he one day might go too far, that his business and his family will suffer because of it. As he raises his children well, I see other Muslims not doing so, these children in turn lacking self esteem, breaking laws and becomming extremists. Sharia I suspect will become the new world order if they continue like this. Not because all Muslims want the whole package but because they're all Muslims and Muslims must stay together. Btw, I see Sharia in general as a huge threat to mankind.

I'm sorry for this post being a mess but I'm on a tight schedule, I write as I remember..

Hoping to hear from you.

Your's, (-:b

hugh watt said...

hi david/nabeel.i understand how people who do not dialogue with muslims may view your actions in a negative way.i too engage with them and find many (Muslims) who do not know what islam teaches on much of what you bring out.it's not uncommon to get the sort of reaction i saw on your Dearborn item.anyway, keep up the love and dialogue with these souls, God loves them and so must we.

Mark said...

Nabeel and David, my attention was drawn to the Arabfest video. As a pastor, I am left to answer those who are now alarmed, especially those who equate Christianity with cultural Americanism (the American Way!), to which several comments heard later in the video appeal.

After viewing the video, I decided that a look at your website was necessary and I feel better about your intentions.

The problem with showing up unannounced with a camera is that it is considered confrontational. It looks like "investigative reporting" which is regarded as invasive. This in turn led to the type of Arab response that appears to be what Americans have been conditioned to expect.

Why allow your ministry to be tainted in this way? You say you love Muslims, therefore, let it be seen on the video. It would be better to be seen as a loving neighbor dropping in for a chat.

Things may have turned out better if you had asked the people at the Arab booth if you could video record a dialogue. They would have been able to determine their best apologist and you could have had a lively, friendly conversation. Just ask a question and let them give long winded answers. That's all. No confrontation. Afterward you could also have asked for some video time in the booth and they may have complied.

After the event, you could develop a separate video to answer what you discovered in the first video. You could even ask the group to respond to you on video. The continual interaction between you and the other group would get many people thinking about Jesus. And you never would have to be confrontational!

I believe you have great insight into Muslim ways and religion. These people need Jesus in their lives and I hope that your ministry will be a key participant in this area in years to come.

May God's richest blessings be with you...

David Wood said...

Hi Mark,

If you watch our "Responses" video, you'll see that the Muslims at the booth gave us permission (twice) to record our conversation.

vagabond said...

hello there i just want to ask whether u heard about peace tv by dr. zakir naik, i can assure u , u will get all your answers about the misconceptions of Islam and answer to all your doubts, he is a renowed scholar of not just islam but all compatible religion, i dont know a christian pastor or father or scholar who knows the whole bible by heart, i can bet on that,

by the way are u aware the word christanity doesnot exists in Bible?
Dr zakir naik had a debate with your own Dr william campbell on subject is Bible the word of God,and there he clearly defeated dr campbell and his team and he was humbled to look in the numerous mistakes and errors in Bible and he could quote a single error in the holy Quran.
i am sure it will clear u r mind of all the nonsense.

good watching peace tv

vagabond said...

have u watched peace tv,

kate said...

I just want to say congratulations to what u guys r doing. many i mean MANY people will hate u for what u r doing (exposing the truth). but alway remember what JESUS said, the world hates u b/c ur not one of their own, they hate ME (JESUS) first,everyone who loved JESUS was persecuted. Paul,the twelve disciples,Timothy (who was stoned to death), i can go on and on but u get the point. trust me ppl hate me also for speaking abt Christ, but hay JESUS love is greater than mans love. keep it up im an avid stokers of u guys. meaning u guys r one of my many source of info on on the dangers of Islam. JESUS bless u guys!!!!

Nabeel Qureshi said...

Vagabond--

I have watched Zakir Naik - his answers to questions are no better than any other Muslim apologist's answers.

I have challenged him to a debate, as has David. Zakir will never respond, because he only debates people who are not good debaters (i.e. Campbell). If you can get him to debate us, we will be ecstatic.

Thanks,
-Nabeel

Hope said...

I was appalled that this happened in the US, but it is not the first time nor will it be the last. In Hickory, NC a few years back two brothers were arrested by police for passing out Christian literature and it was not even Muslims. The cops had to eat crow when the legal side of it was presented...these brothers are http://christianactionleague.org/news/two-in-hickory-arrested-for-sharing-their-faith-in-christ/missionaries...read it here...

Thomas said...

Have you or are you planning on sending any of this information (video etc) to the Justice Department? Clearly your civil rights were violated....

Fje said...

Hello all,

I would like to comment to this website in general. I don't speak nor write english fluently (i'm from the Netherlands) but i couldn't resist to at least leave a message.

I am a 28 year old algerian-dutch man and i'm very curious about the reasons people have for believing in their religion. Now don't go all "sighing" on me now!! I have a very broad vision (if i may say so myself) and acknowledge that there's no "true" religion. With all due respect, but i think that God did not create man, man created God.

That being said... Let me start off saying that i was raised as a Muslim. I enjoy an atheistic life at the moment as i believe religion is nothing more than a (sincere!) human try of understanding life and laying a groundwork of rules for living life honorable and thankful, or meaningful if you wish.

You say you carry no hatred towards Muslim, yet you provoke and ridicule (what's the english word for this?) everything that has to do with Islam. You say Christianity doesn't have the agression Islam has. With all respect but that's not really true. There has never been so much killing in name of Christianity. Remember the Burning Times, Inquisition. Ofcourse there's a lot of hatred in followers of Islam and in some cases Islam allows agression. But as with Christianity, that should be understood within the context it was meant for in the first place. It is that we humans are so full of agression and we see and experience war all around us, wich makes us interpretate (mind the spelling) things very differently then people would at the time all these religious fundaments were layed down.

There's no god that allows killing in His name. Anyone who thinks that way, is no true Islam follower, nor a true Christian.

It truly hurts to see such rejection and condemnation towards Islam and anyone following it. I don't know the true reason behind this, i cannot believe you truly think Islam is threat. You've probably never experienced the love and friendship one can get from (in this case) a Muslim. It's a great shame that a small group is destroying the image people had of Islam.

I really hope you read this and place it. I have no hatred towards you or this website whatsoever, i just wanted to say that there's more to Islam than many people think.

Greetings to you all!

Vishwanath Gaitonde said...

I appreciate your efforts in spreading awareness about the disease called Islam. I also understand the 3 or 4 point formulae u apply when u attend islamic conferences. This is only going to aggravate the problem.You will get beaten up in public and by public, police will take away ur cameras everytime. You will be left only to run to courts to win your cases. Take my suggestion. Its YOUR country, SAVE IT.

Suggestion:

Rather than having a debate with the public, Have a debate with the islamic scholars IN PUBLIC who come to your country and ridicule your own religion.ex: Zakhir Naik. Publicise your self , get in touch with Zakhir Naik's office whenever he is coming to US. Conduct a debate infront of public. Zakhir Naik never ever debates in person. He only debates in live recordings and in full puclic view. You are Learned enough to challenge him. i suggest dont fall into his trap of comparing Christianity v/s Islam. Only debate on Islam. Remember this!!
Doing this, u dont need your own cameras and security. You are secured in public view. Your voice is heard around the world, as the debate will be broadcasted live around the whole thru Peace TV etc. If you are confident enuf, take my advice. This will make you more popular among Christian masses and make them aware of Islamic consequences.

Good luck brother.

A Staunch Hindu

Clint said...

The problem with having peaceful talks with a Muslim, in your home mind you, is that you don't know if he is planning to kill you and steal your wife and kids! Keep the talks in public areas, and away from loved ones.
Quotes from the "holy" quran.
"Slay the unbelievers wherever you catch them." (2:291) "Fight them, until there is no more dissent and religion is that of Allâh" (2:193) "The vilest of animals in Allâh's sight are those who disbelieve." (8:55) "I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers: smite ye above their necks (beheading) and smite all their fingertips off them." (8:12) "Verily, the unbelievers are unclean." (9:28)

Grumpy Old Man said...

Praise GOD for people like you who boldly proclaim the message of Salvation and reach out to Muslims!

Mayada Mahmoud said...

Why do people devote so much time in to hating Islam?

True Muslims don't hate Christians or Jews? Our religion doesn't teach us to hate Christians or Jews. It teaches that those who are people of the book are brethren and neighbors. Yes, there may be a few bad apples that categorize people of the book as Kafirs (Infidels, or non-Beleivers of one God.)

However, that is not true. True Kafirs are those who reject God completely, or reject the notion of one God, for instance idol worshipers or deity worshippers. Sure there are different interpretations of the form of God (referencing to Trinity), however that still does not qualify one as a Kafir. To call one an infidel or Kafir is a sin of false accusation- and being considered a Kafir has its guidelines and rules.

So ultimately, Christians and Jews are not Infidels, non-beleivers or Kafirs.

So why are Muslims being slandered for having their own beliefs in a monotheistic God?

Is this site not the same as calling Muslims Kafirs? We are not non-beleivers of God, we believe in the same God you believe in, we just have our own interpretation of God.

Yes, we reject the belief of Christians that Jesus is God. However, do not forget that Jews do too.

So why are Muslims and Jews put on two different ends, when ultimately, we share the major common view that puts off Christians?

Perhaps it may be that the Old Testament comes in to play here, that Jews and Christians share the same texts, therefore making them closer in religion.

However, Muslims also share similarities in the Holy Bible's sacred texts, as does the Qur'an.

It is just upsetting and confusing being a student of Comparative Religion (focusing on Islam, Christianity and Judaism.) to see such an abundance of sites, books and media dedicated to bashing Islam, when in reality, Islam does not truly teach or hold these same values.

Nor does Christianity, (correct me if you may,) but your religion is also a religion of peace proclamation.

I guess in reality, we shall never have coexistence amongst our religions, weather you be Christian, Jewish or Muslim, and that is a fair stance. But as religious conservatives, we should instead, focus on learning, and teaching our religion better than our opposers. That is the true secret to religious success in spreading our beliefs to the masses. That is why we Muslims are so successful to welcoming the billions of converts to our religion. It was not because we slayed them by the sword, or demoted Christianity or Judaism with propaganda and twisting verses and religious beliefs to mold them to believe our religion. But a true Muslims brought non-Muslims to Islam by showing them the peaceful face of Islam, praying for them, showing them the utmost kindness and love, giving charity, and feeding those who are hungry. Showing non-beleivers that a true Muslim is happy and humbled, and we do not need to butter up our religion, nor do we have to tear down others to bring Islam forth. Its not a competition, ultimately, we believe God chooses those who will be saved by Islam. We can only be on our best behavior as Muslims, and do our part in Dawah (missionary work for Islam) but we cannot chose our believers, they come to us through God.

So those of you who believe you can control the world with posting the most wretched bits of Islam and manipulating our sacred texts and holy hadiths and Qur'an to feed into this propaganda-- I hate to break it to you, but it wont work. If anything, you lead those curious minds, who absorb every little peace and bit you post to the world, to come to us, for more questions, answers, and ultimately to finding truth.

Coyotesx5 said...

I am an Arizonan (g'head...boycott us!) with a deep-seated hatred for Islamofascism. Unlike many "open-minded" Christians, I see danger in REGULAR Islam. Why? Because Islam is a "religion" that glorifies DEATH, not life. It was a "faith" heralded by a pedophile who married a six-year old girl named Aisha and consummated that marriage when she was only nine!...and that pedophile went by the name of Mohammed! After 9/11,in the interest of fairness, decorum, and intelligence, I went on a crusade of sorts to learn everything I could about Islam...and I did. I read the Quran, the Surah, and the Hadith. I have pillars of Islam coming out of my ears! Now I can speak with AUTHORITY that this "religion" has NO PLACE IN AMERICA and we must do everything we can to discourage the formation of a Caliphate. It's either them or US, and it isn't going to be them! Forget the mosque in Manhattan...and screw the pacifists who support its placement anywhere near the consecrated blood-soaked ground of the WTC. Obama supports this travesy...he's pushing against Christianity a little too hard and a little too much. He ought to stop while he's ahead. I have heard from insiders that the Secret Service has its hands FULL. It's time for Obama to back away from this issue, admit that he is a murtadd (apostate)and a liar. You should remember Obama's interview with George Stephanopoulos...where he committed a Freudian slip and discussed his Muslim faith multiple times, even requiring correction by George. Recently he told the Egyptian foreign minister that he IS Muslim. What'll it be? I'll tell you...he's a Muslim with a penchant for Black Liberation Theology (condemned by the Church) and he would love to see our WTC killing fields desecrated by Islam.

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

Is allah and Jehovah the same?

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

Do you realize what you are saying when you say, " we just have our own interpretation of god "?

Watchman

Mayada Mahmoud said...

PART 1:
Again, I stand in the clear when I say site's such as this are breeding grounds for hate (another contradiction to your FAQ statements.)

Coyotesx5, every single thing you said in your post was incorrect about Islam, Obama, and the World Trade Center/ 9/11. You took a few facts and turned them into twisted bits of fictional lies manipulating the truth to fit into the way you want to see the world.

For someone to even agree with you, they would have to also have "a deep-seated hatred for Islamofascism," or whatever you want to call it, and by the way that isn't even a word, and I honestly believe you know NOTHING about Muslims or Islam.

For one, Islam and Muslims have lived in America as long as probably your ancestors have. YES I said it, Muslims were here just as long as you were. They were taken as slaves, and through the generations left Islam out of fear, beatings, and torture. However, there were also Muslims who came to America for opportunity. Arab's for instance brought new technologies and economic wellness to the United States as any new opportunist would, weather from European decent or not. Your not a native, and neither are we. You would have to be ignorant to honestly believe only "Whites" made it to America- this is NOT your land to begin with, so to say statements such as " This religion has no place in America."

From the looks of your argument your a racist, and supposedly proud of it? I hope you have realized that you're posting on a site developed by individual/s who are convert to christianity, and not originally born in America I presume, correct me if I am incorrect, but seems to be from Indian decent. One of the runners of this site is named Nabeel?!?! Thats an Arabic name. So to say that you support the Arizonan's new law to discriminate against anyone with color, is pretty much discriminating the creator's of this site, and any other Christian convert who isn't WHITE or AMERICAN.

Also, another bit of info for you, Melanochroi are dark-whites that descended from Southern Europe. They were Europeans with Arab features. When they migrated to the U.S., in the south, they had distinctive Arab features such as olive complexion, darker hair, etc. However, they were "whites," as for as they knew. But in reality, they came from Arab, North African and Asian decent.
Today, they are your average American with olive skin and brown hair, not your typical blonde hair blue eyes American. However, historically, they descended form Arabs. They wouldn't allow their kids to play outside in the sun of fear that they would tan too darkly and be considered non-white. Abraham Lincoln was Melanochroi.

Mayada Mahmoud said...

PART 2:
But that is a diversion form my general topic... Anyhow, to correct your post...
"Regular" Islam is no different than "regular" Christianity and "regular" Judaism. We all sprout form an Abrahamic religion making us all close brothers in faith and culture. The Muslims in the Middle East are just as the Christians and Jews in the Middle East living the life closest to our religious culture. Eating the same foods (dates, olives, milk etc.) wearing similar clothes, similar prayer rituals, visiting same holy sites, the only difference from then and now is the technology. But in general those conservatives overseas are very close to our religious beliefs we prize now. So to slam Muslims as being backwards is like slamming the religious Christians and Jews overseas who live very similar to the Muslims overseas.
Also, Islam does NOT glorify death, it is haraam (forbidden in Arabic) to kill yourself. Blowing yourself, women and children to smithereens is not martyrdom. True Martydom is only attacking those who attack you. Women and children do not attack, therefore that is not a form of martydom. The "attack" at the World Trade Center on 9/11 was NOT martydom. Killing the innocent is not martydom. Therefore, all those killings who certain Muslim terrorist groups consider martydom are by Islam are not martydom, and God will punish those wrong doers. They want to categorize and justify what they do under that label, but in actuality, it is unIslamic.
Also, another bit of information you did not know. Afghanistan, Pakistan, and all other locations where "Muslim" terrorist groups sprout evidentially, are actually countries where they know very little about their religion. Does it not occur to you that perhaps, these people who do such things really aren't religious? That perhaps, their only response to the tragedies that happen to their families, children, or country are in reaction to their actions back on attacking Americans?
Some of these "religious fighters" don't know the basics of their religion, like you, they only take bits and peaces they like, and use it to their advantage, but they don't take the religion as a whole. It may say in the Qur'an to attack infidels (Kafirs) who are to hurt you or your religion. However, People of the Book (Christians, Jews) are not Kafirs, for they belief in one God, and come form the same Abrahamic decent as Muslims do. Therefore, you are not enemies but brethren.
But if those Taliban leaders, or whatever else terrorist groups out there think otherwise, it is because they skip the fact that religiously, the cannot attack you. The only right they would have to attack you, is if you attacked first. And the Prophet taught us precautions about going with attacking Kafirs or non-Muslims. A.) you do not attack kids, or women, B.) you only attack men of good health, so fighting a sick old man does not count. If the 9/11 attacks were caused by Muslims (which I believe is a BIG FAT GOVERNMENT LIE) Maybe Masonry agenda had to do with this, than a TRUE Muslim would not have carried out attacks of that sort. But it makes very clear sense that the Government or Masonry agenda was behind this, the most powerful people in the world are Masons, the New World order is to cause Global War. Or it could be holy war agenda, to bring forth Armageddon. Either one of these reasons make more sense than Muslims actually doing this.

Mayada Mahmoud said...

PART 3:
You said that, "Mohammed was a pedophile," how dare you say such insulting things, do your research first!
The Prophet Mohamed (peace and blessings be upon him,) took interest in Aisha at a young age, (may have been six) but he did not marry her till she was 9. Back then girls would marry at very young ages to preserve their reputation (staying virgins till marriage) and have someone to look after them and take care of their daughters because most parents were to poor to support and feed all those mouths. Marrying your daughter off at a young age in all cultures was socially accepted because it helped take burden off the parents, and it would secure a safe home for their daughters. Keep in mind, supposedly the Virgin Mary was married off at 15!

He did not sleep with her till she was MUCH older, at that time he had multiple wives already. I am a 21 year old female, growing up in America all my life, and I see nothing wrong with polygamy as long as it is preformed in a proper and religious manner. The Prophet Mohamed (Peace and blessings upon him) married multiple women for many reasons, many were widows, divorced, or elder women who needed a man to provide for them because back then society wasn't to easy for women just as society was only 60 years ago. In Islam, one can only preform Polygamy if he has a reason, say his wife cannot bear children, than he may marry a woman who can. However, he must treat both wives exactly equal, giving them approximate time shared with their husband, giving them both their own home, exactly, or very similarly alike, giving them cars for instance, that are at equal value, etc. When you consider these guidelines, it is VERY difficult for a Muslim man to support one wife! So taking on another is very burdensome and hassling. Also, Polygamy is still practiced in the Middle East, for instance, women who have been displaced by the war, their husband died, and they are left on the streets with children, it is very suitable for them to marry into a polygamous marriage to have someone take care of a women with children. When you look at it that way, it is actually a very safe and mindful practice for women who would otherwise never get the chance to remarry.

However, Prophet Mohamed (peace and blessings be upon him) brought faith to pagan land. they were idol worshipers. They would murder new born daughters by burying them alive in the sand. Orgies and rape was prevalent in the land, alcohol consumption was high, it was a very barbaric society, (just as romans, or any non-religous society was) There was no social justice for women, thieves and mistreatment of slavery was also very prevalent. Prophet Mohamed (peace and blessings be upon him) was sent as a Prophet by God for the Middle East. Islam was not spread by the sword, as common anti-Muslims believe. The believers of Islam gathered followers, they later concurred and brought faith to other non-religious countries and inviting other nations to Islam, who came because they had met true Muslims through commerce, or have been treated well by the Muslims, (a TRUE way to bring people to religion.) Business brought so many countries to Islam, the Arab peninsula was a trading port for countries such as rome, greece, south Asia, europe, and Africa. People from all over the middle east would come through the arab peninsula as commercial trading ports do now, for business transactions, or rest stops. On their journey, they would meet humble Muslims who would not cheat them in business, they would not inflate their prices, their goods were of quality. They treated their business partners with the most respect, fed them the same food they ate, and gave them gifts. The traders and business partners took great friendship in Muslims and ultmately, converted by the masses.

Mayada Mahmoud said...

PART 4:
Where Muslims used the sword was in conquring land, just as Columbus and American settlers do. You fight till the weaker country gives up their territory. However, the Muslims would not kick the inhabitants of that land out, they would allow them to live along side the muslims as long as they abided by their rules, and paid taxes. The Ottoman empire is a great example of religious government. They treated the Jews and christians well, allowed them to practice their own religion, and live alongside them in their land. But they did pay taxes, and were of lesser citizens, however. It was still fair, not like the Christian crusaders who tortured Jews, and other inhabitants of their land.
To get back to your statements. I have one thing to say to you... you know NOTHING about Muslims and Islam, get your facts strait before posting horrible not true "facts" about Muslims and Islam. Muslims don't go around saying garbage about Christians?!?! That would be a sin, in the english language we call that BLASPHEME!

And dont you mean "Qur'an, Sunnah and hadith." (Not surah, a Surah is a chapter in the Qur'an genius!) And what does that mean, "I have pillars of Islam coming out of my ears?" That makes no sense, as their are only 5 pillars of Islam? and I wish you would name them since your such an "expert" So far, I have had to correct EVERYTHING you said, its all wrong, your no authority, nor expert.

And what the heck do you mean by "discourage the formation of a Caliphate?" Do you know what that means in the first place? Its a picked Religious leader, its like picking a pope. Except a Caliphate would be a spokes person as a whole for the Muslim nation, he would be incharge of governing the Muslims as a whole. Do you know how unlikely that is of actually forming for the WHOLE world of Muslims out there? It would take MAJOR organization, and its not that simple. So you can set your fears aside, it's not happening anytime soon.

"Its either them or us," Seriously? When did this come into play, it has never been a them or us in our past, it has always been peaceful, Muslims, Christians and Jews lives side by side, worshiping in Jerusalem. This modern era of hate has only happened since Israel came in to existence, before, Palestine was a place for All christians, Muslims and Jews to live. Now, all of a sudden, Israel conquer Palestine, year by year causing more havoc, wars, and kicking out the original inhabitants (palestinians) to a little peace of land called Gaza. And even that they want a peace of.

Mayada Mahmoud said...

PART 5 (FINAL):
Let me tell you something that you are not going to want to hear... I am a conservative, not a liberal, but America is a very liberal society. Television, Music and media is become the seed to dumbfounded obese American children. It is shaping your minds, and your children's minds. Do you know why? Most of Media is run by Jews. Not conservative jews, but liberal jews, they are more concerned about making money, than the western culture as a whole. I have nothing against Jews, but liberal jews are dangerous, they make fun of Christianity and Islam. I have never seen Muslims make fun of Christians or Jews on their television shows, or songs, or media. EVER. WE DONT DO THAT! Sienfeild, Larry David show, friends, and many other main stream shows take religion as a JOKE!

Television shows aimed towards entertainment has become, sexual, anti-religious, and is being showed to our children. Its norm to society now to know who Hannah Montana is, watch MTV sexy videos, and sexist shows like the Bachelorette. We no longer are offended by these immoral behaviors, but they bring joy and entertainment to us. The media industry is what ruined your conservative country, not Muslims. We are for raising children with the best ideals. NOT shows that promote teen sex, and pregnancies. ABC's family channel, Disney, Nickelodeon, none of these channels are safe for children anymore. They have dirty jokes, adult humor, show sexuality in adolescence, and give girls and young boys the idea that life is about having fun and not about finding God. You wonder why so many people are atheist, or extreme liberals? Its because they grow up on the Western cultural ideal... And that my friend was NOT started by Muslims. We aren't hurting your religion, you guys are, by allowing the attack to your conservative ways of life.

Enough about that, I could go on forever...
The mosque in manhattan is TWO BLOCKS AWAY FROM WTC!!! There's a Synagogue and a church in or around ground Zero, why arent they getting attacked worship near there?

OBAMA is a Christian?!?! Why would he be pushing against Christianity? He supports Israel, that definitely doesn't make him a Muslim?? He goes to Church!!! Why doesn't his wife dress more conservatively if she's a "Muslim"? Hmm??? Can you answer those questions for me??? He's no Muslim, he is a liberal with mindful ideals that aren't realistic. He is delusional, but he is a good president.

My field of study is to answer people like you, and people on this site who want to attack Islam, but don't know Islam, and they don't know much of their religion either.

Mayada Mahmoud said...

To answer your question if Allah and Jehovah are the same...

Jehovah is a word derivative, it gives power, and authority to the name by an anglicized respresentation of "the proper name of God". It is a transliteration of Hebrew יְהֹוָה‎, a vocalization of the sacred Tetragrammaton יהוה, the name that, according to the Bible, God revealed to his people.
It is the personal name of God in the Hebrew Scriptures. Just as Yahweh: a name for the God of the Old Testament as transliterated from the Hebrew consonants YHVH.
Muslims also give proper names to God, "Al-" is "The" in Arabic, when used, you may say, "Al-Rahim," which stands for, the Merciful. It's a form of respect when saying God's name, and not just saying it in vane, or out of context. But yes, Jehovah, Yahweh, are the same as Allah.

Mayada Mahmoud said...

When I said, "We have our own interpretation of God," I meant, that We believe in the same God, we just interpret the worship, differently. Our scriptures are different, our cultures are different. But generally speaking, we are of the same.

I did not mean that we have some kind of fictional God, or we make up our interpretation of God, it's just that we believe different than what you believe. Thats all, but in all actuality, it is the same God we speak of.

Does that answer your question, or did you mean something else? Your questions was kind of vague.

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

By quran, Jehovah and allah, cannot be the same.
It is easily googled to establish that such a statement is an egregious error. Indeed, if at 21 you are a student of comparative religion, then from your assertions in your answer, you are either purposely deceptive or innocently deceived.
quran 19:88-92 asserts that the thought of allah having a son is so monstrous that heavens and mountains are to shaken and crumbled. It is the most abhorrent thought to a muslim to even suggest he would if he could.
And, that is why Jehovah and allah are not the same.
Too, the muslim thought regarding the Christian view of the Trinity which you casually include in your remarks, is that of the worshipof Mary, Jesus, and allah as contempories, associates together as gods. This is found in the interrogative in surah 5:116 and easily extrapolated from the wording.
Being the student you profess to be, you should know this is completely erroneous, as the Triune nature of Jehovah is described as thus, the Father is God, Jesus is God ( the Incarnate, Jehovah manifest in the flesh ) , the Holy Spirit is God. That is not to say three gods as some wrongly assume, but the One Jehovah.
Dishonesty never wears well on it's bearer and if indeed it is an innocent error, than we may not overlook it, but rather correct our understanding once it is made known to us.
Also, you do know that to confess Christ as Jehovah God manifest in the flesh is " shirk " do you not?
In this your statement that Jehovah and allah are the same is deceptive.
Please take time to inform yourself as to Psalm 2:7:

" I will tell of the decree :
The Lord ( Jehovah ) said to me, " You are my son; today I have begotten you ".

No, Mayada, Jehovah and allah are not the same, and the blindness that is in Israel is to be healed, and they too shall know indeed that Messiah has come.

There is much more we can speak of should you choose.

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

You do know that the Israelites were down in Egypt for 400 years before being brought out by Jehovah's mighty arm? As concerning muslims in America, would that then cause one to believe Egypt should celebrate it's Israeli heritage? Egypt today has little courtesy to extend to either Christians or Jews.
I am concerned at risk of offending you, your remarks that this site promotes hate are ill informed. Indeed, the acknowledgement of hate or hateful actions is necessary to protect one's self from injury or malicious intent, but can you assuredly state that such hate is not part and parcel of islam?

I invite both you and our other participants to open the following. There is nothing violent here but the seed of violence, coming from one so young and impressed upon them by mature adults is tragic. I gather from your remarks that you do not share the same views but, further reflection causes me to believe that should you know your quran and adhere to it, you certainly must hold this view else you are not in the faith.

Type in "basmallah, apes and pigs " on YouTube

gran'pa said...

In any event, I sincerely hope we can continue this conversation. The Jehovah of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, indeed, the Father who has loved us, and gave us His Son, requires of us to " love one another, even as Christ loved the church and gave Himself for it. Even as we were yet sinners, He died for us. It gives a whole new perspective Mayada to the phrase, " Love your enemies ". I do not consider you an enemy, only one yet to receive the saving knowledge of Christ the Lord.

You can see how "shirk" can present a problem in our relationship with one another if you hold to it.
I know the Lord loves you, and should you believe that I am an infidel of the worst sort, it will be difficult indeed to continue this conversation.

This is the 2nd of the prior comments and are to be read as one post.

God Bless you, Mayada

As an aside, you must acknowledge too, that it was the warring tribes on what is known as the " dark continent " that ruthlessly slaughtered their brothers in neighboring villages and delivering other unfortunates to the merchants and slavers of those days. No one is suggesting that slavery is good, and in fact it was a Christian man Wilberforce if I recall correctly who did so much to stop the hateful practice as concerning England's traders.

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

This is on the assumption that you check back from time to time? I am disappointed that you with your credentials, have opted to be silent in the face of critizism. You make the allegation that persons who don't " know islam " are the antagonists, and that they know little of their own religion either.
I sincerely regret any thought you may hold that perhaps I or others have any contempt for muslims or yourself, I do not, yet at the same time you must recognize a defense is just that, a defense, and not an aggressive unprovoked attack with intent to harm.
There is only one of several perogitives that exist, that most if not all the world agrees to,
The quran and the Bible are both false.
The quran and the Bible are both true, ( which is an untenable position ) as demonstrated above.
The Bible is true and the quran false.
The quran is true and the Bible is false.
Jesus is the promised Messiah and a true prophet of God.
Jesus is a false prophet and therefore any claims of Sonship are not relevant either to Christians or muslims, or the world for that matter.
Remember again, a defense is precisely that, a defense, and not an aggressive unprovoked attack. It is not to be likened to a behavior such as, " I couldn't help myself, you just make me so mad, it's your fault "! This type of response is often simultaneous with shouting and physical violence such as when a husband beats up his wife for some alledged wrong.
That has nothing to do with a " righteous defense ".
You must acknowledge that you enjoy a relatively trouble free existance in the U.S. I am not saying that you may not experience some anxiety from time to time, but overall your interactions have been pleasant.
Please respond.
God bless you Mayada.
In closing, the Old Testamaent law of " eye for eye, tooth for tooth, limb for limb...", yet is in force and effect, when concerning the person of Christ. What shall you do Mayada? Will you stand alongside those evil men who took the Lord of Life and wantonly and mercilessly abused and tormented him ? Will you too say, this man has blasphemed and is worthy of death ?
You do not have the price in your hand Mayada, for your own life. Only Jesus has the required form of payment acceptable to God Almighty. Should you neglect that, then, your life shall be required at His hand.
Mayada, the only record that you have that you may confidently look to to bring you into a clear understanding of who the Messiah is indeed, is the Old and New Testaments. The only source that mohammed had at his disposal, were the verbal histories made available to him by Jews and Christians, else he could not have arrived at the conclusions he did and for his purposes cleverly crafted to be unrecognizable to both. It was because of this that his intentions became cruel, and play out to this day in the most recognizable and egregious conduct.
Please answer.

Mayada Mahmoud said...

Hello Gran'pa,

It's Mayada :)

I am sorry for not getting back to you sooner. I was intending to do so, I have been really busy. I have my personal e-mail on my blog (something I have been also neglecting,) but I prefere we communicate through e-mail if you are alright with that. I would like to continue these conversations, but I don't want to feel like I have to defend my religion to people who will continue to be close minded. I am with family now, so I haven't been online much at all. But as soon as I get back to my normal schedule, I would love to pick up where we left off.

Sincerely,

M.M.

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

When Nicodemas came to Jesus, he did so at night. There was a reason for this, Nicodemas was a Pharisee and a ruler of the Jews.
You may recall, if you are familiar with the story, the parents of a man blind from birth. They insisted that any questions to be asked concerning the restoration of their son's sight be directed to the son ; " He is of age: ask him: he shall speak for himself ". The parents responded in this manner because they feared the Jews, who in this case were Pharisees for the Pharisees had agreed already that if anyone confessed that Jesus was the Christ, they should be put out of Synagogue.
Both in Nicodemus's case and that of these parents, apprehension was a reality in their actions regarding Jesus. What consequence might arise out of what might be seen of them, what they came to believe, or what they might possibly say ?

"...but I don't want to feel like I have to defend my religion...closed minds ". Mayada, these are your words.

I have not decided should we continue this conversation on these pages or privately by E-mail. we are certainly free to do either should the owners of this site not object. I would hope that you would have a desire to defend truth.
There is no reason that we cannot be friends, though I do recognize as you also, there is a proscription against such an acknowledgement.
I am a man with grown children who for the most part are somewhat older than you. I have lovely grandchildren, and I will give to you the same respect and consideration, indeed, the same love I give to them, and you need not be afraid.
Not of myself, or my family or our confidence in Christ our Saviour.

gran'pa said...

I regret if this a double post but, something did not go right on this ancient computer of mine.

Mayada,

I understand that with ramadan coming up, you are busily occupying yourself with preparations but can you take a moment and tell me if Abraham was a muslim and if so, what does that mean? Does that mean he guided people in allah's way? Were his confidants muslim, his servants? Did he surround himself with muslims? Were they all muslim who were of Abraham's household? Had allah shown not only Abraham but all who were his immediate household, the perfect way? Did they all know it? Would Abraham have anyone who was so close to him as to be a trusted servant, have such a one as a servant, were that person not a muslim? Would mohammed have had such a person in his inner circle? Would they have behaved as muslims today, following the way of allah? You may think I am being disrepectful of you but I am not.
I am not asking you to cast yourself down from a high place such as when the Lord was tempted of the evil one in the gospels. I am asking me to answer honestly as you would a loved one or close friend who was confidant with you. Surely you can do that? Don't be so angry, or have your vision too clouded to not be able to answer. I concern myself that we may not be able to have an honest conversation because of forced misunderstandings. I will be honest with you, irrespective of any alledged offense or hostility you may feel I entertain.

Gran'pa

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

I hope that you are still checking back from time to time.
There was an error in the last post which I am sure you understood.

" I am asking me to answer honestly as you would a loved one or close friend ... " should have read, "I am asking you..."

Gran'pa

Mayada Mahmoud said...

Hello,
Gran'pa,

I receive your messages periodically, as I do not check my e-mail when traveling as often as I would at home.

I will answer briefly your last comment.

All of Gods Prophets/ Messengers are considered Muslims to us. When I say "Muslim," the true definition of its literal meaning is- a slave submitting to the will of God. The word "Muslim" is the word we use to define a follower of God, anyone can be a Muslim. However, not everyone is a Muslim. To be a Muslim, you must except God alone, with no partners, you must pretty much submit to the Ten Commandments, and do everything in life for God. That is, when you eat, you contemplate of God, when you raise your kids, you raise them to be followers of God, you do not over indulge, you live your life to worship God.
That is how TRUE Muslims are supposed to be, not even some Muslims who follow Islam are TRUE Muslims.
There are also different grades of being in Islam, there is a Muslim, Mu'men, and Muhsen. Prophets are better then Muhsen, they are Gods Chosen. ( http://www.aljazeerah.info/Islamic%20Editorials/2007/May/Three%20Levels%20of%20Faith%20Islam,%20Iman,%20and%20Ihsan%20By%20Hassan%20El-Najjar.htm )

I can't answer your Abraham question as thoroughly at the moment, as it is too lengthy of an answer. However, I will get back to you as soon as I can.

And no, you did offend me.

gran'pa said...

mayada,

Did you mean mumin?
Was Abraham mumin, or mushen?
Irrespective, how would Abraham choose his close associates and confederates? Were they mushen, or mumin?
Who would Abraham have to swear an oath to him? If he were to entrust a person to do his bidding and seal that trust by an oath, would the swearer be mushen or mumin? What level of association would Abraham require of the one swearing an oath? Am I correct that in islam there are three levels of belief or profession?
Please do not neglect the previous post's questions because they answers are important for a clearer understanding.

Gran'pa

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

Conversationally, I am amused by your not responding to what should be an effortless question to answer. The quran offers proscriptions for the most significant details of our lives, how we are to behave, how we are to interact, and certainly, how to best achieve our aims, under the guidance and tutalage of allah.I understand the foregoing from what has been suggested by the followers of the quran. That, and their reliance on the sunnah of allah's prophet.
There really is no urgency for you to answer, but if you desire to know more how I think, then I believe you would more eagerly correspond.
Again, hoping you still check back from time to time.
The question remains, was Abraham a muslim? Were his close associates bonified muslim, not irresponsible or indifferent, not lukewarm, but avid worshippers of allah. Especially so, his servants also.
Please answer.

Mayada Mahmoud said...

Dear Gran'pa,

I have already answered your question, but I will elaborate it further here, as I had commented earlier that those elaborations would have to come later as I am out of town, with limited access to the internet, and quite very busy in this month of Ramadan.

According to Muslims, any Prophet of God is considered a Muslim. Does that mean his associates were, no. Were they Christian or Jewish? No.
If they were close associates of Abraham, or Moses, or Jesus, or Noah; and they followed and believes those chosen prophets, then they were followers of God, meaning they were Muslim (that is according to Muslims. As I had explained before, in Arabic, the literal meaning of "Muslim" is follower of God, also Allah in Arabic. Calling someone a Muslim, means he follows the word and message of God.) Therefore, it corresponds to the meaning of Christians calling someone a Christian, or those of the Jewish faith calling someone a Jew. It all generally means follower of God.

So to go back to your question- If Abraham was a Muslim, what were his close associates? They must have been Muslim too because they followed the commands of Abraham, did they not? Did they not believe Abraham when he claimed prophecy? If so, and they accepted his word, ultimately accepting God, then they would, according to Islam be a Muslim.

Mayada Mahmoud said...

Your questions regarding, Muslim, Mu'men, and Muhsen, please refer to the earlier post with the link to an article explaining who exactly would be such.

I cannot say what or who they were, but prophets were closely considered Muhsen, and higher. However, those followers who, have just embraced his world, and follow to the best of their ability, perhaps were just Muslim. As I said, there is no way in telling you what level of faith or Iman they had. For I have no documents or evidence to support that question.

Also, the levels of faith are not of importance, I just made reference to prove to you that Muslims give names to higher level of faith and practice to a Muslim. Just as there are names for Christians (that I know of,) who also have higher names of faith for followers, such as saint, priest, father, nuns etc. It is of similar connotations.

Mayada Mahmoud said...

Also, on final note for now, not to be offensive or anything. But I would like to make clear, that I do not appreciate leaving many hits (by visiting such sites that promote hate, or discrimination) overtime I sign in, to respond to posts, I am giving positive feedback to sites that promote opposition to my own personal views and values. I do not value hate, or discrimination, therefore, I do not wish to continue conversations through sites that offer this type of content or materials. They are entitled to their views, but I will not become one of their statistics. If you wish to continue educated religious conversation/ debate, I suggest you find other means to contact me, via e-mail, or through my blog, or through another happy medium :)


If this is at an inconvenience for you, or you do not wish to continue legitimate conversations on religion with me because I wish not to communicate through this site. Then I advice you locate a religious Muslim leader such as an Imam or Sheikh of a Mosque, or a Muslim in your local community who you trust, or maybe even going to a local college where you may communicate with educated Muslim individuals from the Muslim Student Organizations, or professors on campus who can answer your questions, (suggesting a Muslim professor, but doesn't have to be, just someone who can give you unbiased conversation, or even biased if it will answer your questions fairly. You may even surveying students of their religious knowledge and getting your questions answered.
There are also many coexistence events I could reference you to where religious officials and leaders (from Christian faith, Muslim, and Jewish faith) gather to discuss religion.
All these sources are good, and fair places to discuss religion with religious sound minded individuals.

I do hope you decide to continue conversations with me, but at this time. I wish not to use this site any further to promote their values through my constant and continuing of commenting etc.

I hope you understand my intentions.

Thank you and have a good day!

Mayada Mahmoud said...

Your questions regarding, Muslim, Mu'men, and Muhsen, please refer to the earlier post with the link to an article explaining who exactly would be such.

I cannot say what or who they were, but prophets were closely considered Muhsen, and higher. However, those followers who, have just embraced his world, and follow to the best of their ability, perhaps were just Muslim. As I said, there is no way in telling you what level of faith or Iman they had. For I have no documents or evidence to support that question.

Also, the levels of faith are not of importance, I just made reference to prove to you that Muslims give names to higher level of faith and practice to a Muslim. Just as there are names for Christians (that I know of,) who also have higher names of faith for followers, such as saint, priest, father, nuns etc. It is of similar connotations.

Frank said...

I watched your "Mosques and Men" video on YouTube. Where can I get the photos you featured in the video (Liberty wearing a burka; NY skyline full of minarets)? Thank you for standing between the darkness and the light.

David Wood said...

You can get the pictures here:

http://www.answeringmuslims.com/2010/05/of-mosques-and-men-muslim-mindsets-as.html

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

I was hoping that we could continue here. You are too easily offended. I believe there is another mechanism at play rather than perceived insult.
But, back to Abraham.
In the Book, the story is related of the taking of an oath by Abraham's servant. Now, at this time Abraham was very old, and the servant was the eldest of all his servants, and ruled over all that Abraham had.
Abraham caused this servant to make an oath, swearing by the Lord, the God of heaven.
This Lord,to a Christian, is Jehovah.
But for your purposes, let us allow you to say the servant made an oath to allah. Recall, I have stated before that by quran, Jehovah and allah cannot be the same, and this is indeed a continual source of enmity between Jews, Christians , and muslims. It is why muhammed was rejected as a prophet by the Jews, and also by Christians. And, for this we are hated.
And so, an oath was made by this servant, and the purpose was to insure that the servant would not take a wife of the Canaanites to be wife for Abraham's son, Isaac. Notably, no such injunction is recorded regarding Ishmael in the Book. No record of a similiar oath. In fact, no mention of a wife of Ishmael is made in the Book, although, a daughter of Ishmael is recorded who was taken as wife to Esau.
But to continue, The servant took ten camels, he traveled some distance to a place where he was both not known, and was unrecognizable to the inhabitants.
And this is where an interesting turn takes place.
His first contact was with women, specifically a particular woman named Rebekah.
Now this man was a stranger to her, and she to him. It is not indicated that any men were present, because it is written he purposely went to the well where the women went to draw water.In fact, he specifically prayed to Jehovah, or as necessary in your case, allah, that a certain thing was to happen that he should know he was performing his oath.
As we read further, not only was his prayer answered, but he placed an earring upon the face of a woman very fair to look upon, and braclets upon her hands, but doing so before he knew who she was. It was only after he had done so, that it was revealed whose daughter she was, and the relationship to Abraham, through Nahor, Rebekah's grandfather, Abraham's brother.
The Book records another instance of Rebekah being fair to look upon. It was of so much concern to Isaac, that he required of her to say she was his sister, because he feared the men of Gerar who would look upon her.
Earlier too, in the previous story, when Rebekah went away with the servant of Abraham and they came upon Isaac, only then is modesty indicated in the covering of a vail. First she was not vailed, and then she purposely vailed herself at the approach of Isaac.
What I am saying Mayada, is that several events occured over a period of time that have on the face of it, practices not consistant with those of muslims today. It is indeed a cause of reflection, because when I am able to view a woman, so veiled and hidden from view as to be unrecognizable, in full burqua, being executed publicly by bullets to her head and torso, and then being discarded as you might remove a dead dog from your presence, I marvel at the revelation of the Book, and the revelation of the quran and it's prophet.
Do not misunderstand, I do not hate you. I do not hate muslims. I do desire that a difference be made regarding your apprehension of the Truth that is to be found in Christ.
God bless you , Mayada
Mayada, Jesus said " No lie is of the Truth ", your eternal destiny is in the hands of Christ.
You are young yet, and there is much to be learned.
I will leave you with this, from the Book:
Proverbs 12:17 KJV
"He that speaketh truth sheweth forth righteousness: but a false witness deceit".
What shall you say Mayada of the man called Jesus?

Gran'pa

Mayada Mahmoud said...

PART 1:
Dear Gran'pa,

I appreciate your kind blessings, but I am quite devoted to my religious beliefs, and from years of studying and having religious conversations with those of other faiths, I am quite grounded where I am, but thank you for your kindness!

No, I am not offended, I had a typo earlier when you asked me if I was offended, and I wrote "No, I am offended," I meant to say no I am not offended.

Also, regarding to your most previous post; you brought up to issues that are of concern to you. As for the veil, or burka-- women in Islam are not forced to wear it, but are religiously obligated to wear it.
They wear it because they want the blessings of the Prophet and of Allah, and not to sin every time a man looks upon her with lustful eyes, or if he doesn't, to prevent men from falling into the sin of looking at her with lustful eyes.
It goes both ways, it saves women from sinning, but also men from sinning.

Mayada Mahmoud said...

PART 2:
You may view the burka how you wish, but those women who fear God, and love The Almighty with all their hearts choose to wear that. It is not forced upon them. Some Muslim scholars have a difference of opinion when it comes to the burka, some support it full heartedly, others say it is not a necessary practice, but ultimately, women who choose to wear it, wear it because they Love God, and they want to.

I feel that those who create negativity around Muslims and Islam fog your heart and soul from accepting that Islam is a legitimate religion form God. For instance, the situation regarding women being flogged publicly etc. quite frankly, as I had said earlier, the Shariah implements that these practices are necessary under the following guidelines... Assume the subject had committed adultery. According to the Shariah, they must be publicly flogged till executed. However, to do so, it is VERY DIFFICULT to get to that point, you must first have 4 MALE witnesses, and even with 4 male witnesses you must be proven guilty and all witnesses must have a sound, coherent, and each have approximately identical stories. If they cannot come up with this, and in most cases, you can't. Chances of having that kind of information is hard to get, and far from possible, then it is not possible to honor kill them, and the guiltily accused is no longer guilty.

There is a very foolproof and specific guideline to go about this process, and there is a court that hears the case and so forth.
However, in many cases when you hear such stories it is VERY rare that it was done correctly, or that it happened at all.
I personally do not agree, but according to these guidelines, if followed correctly, then I cannot argue that the measures were not fair to perform the prosecution.

Mayada Mahmoud said...

PART 3:
Just as any case with courts and prosecutions, anyone can argue their justness. You don't have to agree. But I hope that you know that Christianity and Judaism also have a history of honor beatings and killings for just the same sins. Jesus (peace and blessings be upon him) was crucified for blasphemy according to the prosecutors. Before him, there were also crucifixions done for other sins such as stealing, adultery etc. So you cannot escape the truth that it is deeply routed in your faith, as it is mine. Islam is just a faith that hasn’t changed, so what happened 1400 years ago, is still practiced today. Also, throughout the Middle Ages, Jews and Christians conducted punishments such as public punishments for those who sinned. Christians preformed such punishments according to the seven deadly Sins. Being exiled, punished publicly, or even put to death has been practiced historically from all religious backgrounds.
So to shake the finger at Islam is only fair if you observe the fact that many other faiths practiced the same punishments and even worse sometimes.

And as I said before, you can’t blame a beautiful religion for a select few imbeciles who practice it improperly. View Islam openheartedly, but don’t take into account those who claim they are Muslims and really don’t practice as the Qur’an, Sunnah, and Shariah truly teaches us too. If you were to sit down and actually study Islam, textually, and you look beyond the imperfect blemishes of those who claim to be Muslim but make fatal mistakes that hinder the views of others when it comes to Islam. Then you would also see what I see. Nonetheless, as long as you continue to use every negative flaw that happens supporting your judgment on Islam, you will never see the truth and beauty of Islam.

I hope this post doesn’t offend you.

-Mayada

Mayada Mahmoud said...

PART 4:
And as I said before, you can’t blame a beautiful religion for a select few imbeciles who practice it improperly. View Islam openheartedly, but don’t take into account those who claim they are Muslims and really don’t practice as the Qur’an, Sunnah, and Shariah truly teaches us too. If you were to sit down and actually study Islam, textually, and you look beyond the imperfect blemishes of those who claim to be Muslim but make fatal mistakes that hinder the views of others when it comes to Islam. Then you would also see what I see. Nonetheless, as long as you continue to use every negative flaw that happens supporting your judgment on Islam, you will never see the truth and beauty of Islam.

I hope this post doesn’t offend you.

-Mayada

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

No offence taken.
Your assumption that I have not or do not examine islam except being influenced by malignant forces is faulty.
I am intriqued regarding your comment that Jesus was crucified for blasphemy, when each of us understands the tenet of islam is that he was not crucified, but that it was made to appear so. But now, back to my previous post, with the following quote from you.

"As for the veil, or burka-- women in Islam are not forced to wear it, but are religiously obligated to wear it".

Indeed, if they are religiously obligated, then why is the description of Rebekah such in the Book, to suggest that she neither covered herself before muslims, or the Philistines of Gerar? At the most, the covering of the vail at the approach of Isaac, first glance suggesting modesty, could also have been a personal habit or response for reasons known to her not necessarily religiously obligatory. And indeed, if it is a question of causing one to sin, then let's just bag the whole lot up, men and women alike.
I have to be mindful that my remarks can be taken wrongfully, but I am confident you understand I am not ridiculing you, just stating the obvious. If women are to choose to be bagged up, then men too also if they desire a higher expression of islam other than just muslim.
And also, you neglected to answer how a man unknown to the inhabitants of Nahor, a city in Mesopotamia, could violate a most essential proscription being muslim, interact with a woman unknown to him and he to her? If as must be assumed that she too, was muslim, then there should have been no interaction, indeed could not be, no placing of gold ornaments upon the exposed flesh of a fair woman to behold. This, and more, that he presumed to go to a well where he knew the unescorted women would be, while as yet he was a stranger to all?
And why would Isaac fear the men of Gerar?
If she was veiled, how could it be determined she was fair to " look upon "? When Abimilech saw that Isaac was " sporting " with his wife Rebekah, he plainly asked why Isaac had said she was " my sister "? Isaac's answer was because he might die for her, certainly because she was " fair to look upon. Too, Abimilech's concern that because Isaac had not truthfully stated his relationship to her, one of the people might have " lightly lain with her " and brought " guiltiness upon the Philistines. Is that to say they might have " lightly " lain with her under other circumstances and not be guilty?
No, Mayada, you have many questions to answer.
Dear, dear Mayada, I am not berating you, but I am sincerely encouraging you to look beyond the rose colored glasses of islam you are wearing, and consider the beauty of the Gospel of Christ and the truth of His Sonship.
As much as you encourage me to look at islam " open heartedly ", so too I encourage you to look to the Saviour open heartedly.

God bless you, Mayada.

As for the quran Mayada, the latter is judged of the former, the former of which is " The Book ".

Gran'pa

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

No offence taken.
Your assumption that I have not or do not examine islam except being influenced by malignant forces is faulty.
I am intriqued regarding your comment that Jesus was crucified for blasphemy, when each of us understands the tenet of islam is that he was not crucified, but that it was made to appear so. But now, back to my previous post, with the following quote from you.
"As for the veil, or burka-- women in Islam are not forced to wear it, but are religiously obligated to wear it".
Indeed, if they are religiously obligated, then why is the description of Rebekah such in the Book, to suggest that she neither covered herself before muslims, or the Philisines of Gerar? At the most, the covering of the vail at the approach of Isaac, first glance suggesting modesty, could also have been a personal habit or response for reasons known to her other than religiously obligatory. And indeed, if it is a question of causing one to sin, then let's just bag the whole lot up, men and women alike.
I have to be mindful that my remarks can be taken wrongfully, but I am confident you understand I am not ridiculing you, just stating the obvious. If women are to choose to be bagged up, then men too also if they desire a higher expression of islam other than just muslim.
And also, you neglected to answer how a man unknown to the inhabitants of Nahor, could violate a most essential proscription being muslim, interact with a woman unknown to him and he to her.If as must be assumed that she too, was a muslim, then there should have been no interaction, indeed could not be, no placing of gold ornaments upon the exposed flesh of a fair woman to behold. This, and more, he presumed to go to a well where he knew unescorted women would be, while as yet he was a stranger to all.
And why would Isaac fear the men of Gerar?
If she was veiled, how could it be determined she was " fair to look upon "? When Abimilech saw that Isaac was " sporting " with his wife Rebekah, he plainly asked why Isaac had said she was " my sister "? Isaac's answer was because he might die for her, certainly because she was " fair to look upon ". Too, Abimilech's concern that because Isaac had not truthfully stated his relationship to her, one of the people might have " lightly lain with her " and brought " guiltiness upon the Philistines. Indeed, did an opportunity might exist they could have " lightly " lain with her and not be guilty ?
No, Mayada, you have many questions to answer.
Dear, dear Mayada, I am not berating you, but I am sincerely encouraging you to look beyond the rose colored glasses of islam you are wearing, and consider the beauty of the Gospel of Christ and the truth of His Sonship.
As much as you encourage me to look at islam " open heartedly ", so too I encourage you to look to the Saviour open heartedly.

God bless you, Mayada.

Also, regarding the quran. Mayada, you must consider the latter is judged of the former, the former being " The Book ".

BTW, have you listened to your tone? I am specifcally referring to the use of the word " imbecile ".

Mayada, Christians fully acknowledge there are wrong doers even as there are openly ungodly men and women. However, be advised that Christians too, believe the " Book " as the authoritive Word of God and both we and you must face the fact that " When the wicked spring as the grass, and when all the workers of iniquity do flourish: it is that they shall be destroyed forever ". That is the Word of God.
Christ is the only sanctuary from the destruction to come.

I wish to continue with you.

Gran'pa

Mayada M. said...

PART 1:
Dear Gran'pa,

You have the wrong idea of Islam. Women are "bagged-up," as you refer to veiled women because in all religions, women are symbols of lust. Men although can be lustful to women, such as Joseph (Youssef in Arabic) was. However, Islam teaches that women have more self control. And although this is rare, in Islam, if a man believes he causes women to sin out of his good looks, he too con be veiled, not like a woman, but someone how Saudi Arabian men, or men form the peninsula dress. They wear loose fitting white garments, and a veil like covering on their heads. That is appropriate for a man of high beauty- a modest covering if he so desires to veil himself from the lustful eyes of women. However, it is not obligatory, and only an option for men to cover themselves, body, or even face if they believe they are causing women to sin.

Mayada M. said...

PART 2:

Your term used calling veiled women "bagged up," is offensive. I hope you acknowledge the fact that nuns are "bagged-up," the pope is "bagged-up" monks are "bagged-up," and anyone who is very conservatives, and devotes their lives to the worship of God is 90% more likely to wear "bagged-up" clothing that does not reveal their figure, does not call for much attention, or is lose and comfortable and away from modern fashion and expense. Something Prophets would never indulge in (also, prophets would be considered bagged up as they too did not observe fancy expensive clothing and in their time wore baggy like clothes.

I have made this clear countless times. I am no expert, I am a student of knowledge, and I have yet much to learn, so I will not, and do not plan to claim expertise on these topics. Nor can I answer your questions as I do not know the answers to your questions regarding your historical/ religious reference. I just don't know the answers, and cannot formulate an answer for you.

Mayada M. said...

PART 3:
I think you misunderstood my use of the term "Muslim," when I say these people who were close to Abraham, or any prophet of God were Muslim, I do not mean it in the literal term. I mean that "Muslim" is the general term we use to categorize a follower of the word of God. Devote to their belief in God, and do not doubt their sent prophet. So they didn't actually call themselves Muslim, but to Muslims, they were Muslim at the time of that time. We believe Adam and Eve were Muslim and anyone up until now.

I am looking at Christianity open minded, and Judaism as well. Remember, I am devoting my life studies to this. I am a religious studies major, that is my life's work and goal. My heart is open to anyone who is curious, anyone who is willing to learn, and listen. I do not consider myself a "missionary" or anything of that such. That is not my goal. My life's goal is to promote coexistence amongst all monotheistic faiths. You may see why I oppose such sites.

Mayada M. said...

PART 1:
Also,

On final note, you say "Christians fully acknowledge there are wrong doers even as there are openly ungodly men and women...." If this is true, than why are there so MANY sites, media initiatives, Churches by the masses, Jews and Christians out on attacking Muslims and destroying our very essence of existence?

Today, we are the new generation of racial, and religious intolerance. We are being treated very unfairly, Christians and Jews do not like us, and majority of Muslims have no problem with Jews or Christians, we lived amongst you in the Middle East since the dawn our faith came into existence, and way beyond that. But for some reason, majority of non-Muslims all over the world hate us, despise us, and want us dead, or far far away from them?

Mayada M. said...

PART 2:
Maybe, if you believe this, you too should try hard to promote coexistence and fairness of treatment towards Muslims. I know not all Christians and Jews share the beliefs of the majority far right extremists, or even far left extremists. But I personally feel, that I, one Muslim out of the billions in the world, get ridiculed on a frequent basis. And if I, just one, out of Billions am on constant attack, then it must be that every other Muslim in the WORLD also feels the same way I do.
I just hope you understand what I am trying to convey here, I am not an evil doer, I just want the best for everyone. I love who I am, who I was born to be, and I want to practice that for the rest of my life. I am not closed minded, actually I am far from that, my life's goals and aspirations are to become a college professor, a scholar who can teach the world that Muslims are not bad people. My goal is not to do missionary work on the job, but to give people the option of whatever belief they wish. I just want to teach! :) I will practice my faith, pray, fast, and so forth, when curious students or people come to me, I will explain and answer their questions to the best of my ability. I also know that I will continue to encounter people who despise me, but I will continue to be the kindhearted person that I am and not acknowledge them, or help them see that I am no enemy.

Mayada M. said...

PART 5:
This as I have explained countless times over and over again is every non-muslims BIGGEST threat. Not terrorism, or hateful threats. But a devote practicing Muslim who loves everyone and only wants the best for their neighbors, associates, people they encounter in life and day-to-day basis. Religious rightwing extremists should fear them the most, as those people bring forth the MOST converts to Islam, and those people bring so many who were anti-muslim become friendly to muslims and even love them because they are good people, and not bad or even people.

If only those who attacked us could see, and use this tactic as their weapon instead of harsh words, writing false or anti-muslim articles, using the media to their advantage to bash muslims etc.

Also, I forgot to clear the whole Jesus/ blasphemy thing. What I meant by that was that according to non-Muslims, this is why he was crucified, was because he was accused of blasphemy. However, it is true that Muslims believe that he was not crucified, but instead raised to heaven by God.

I hope these posts have answered your questions.

gran'pa said...

Dear Mayada,

Frankly, after having done so, I was more concerned about my remarks that you should remove the rose colored glasses of islam you are wearing. I yet believe that. Rather than being purposely offensive however, I would hope that you would understand that the remark was intended to convey my thought that there is a reluctance on your part to look beyond the Jesus of the world you hold to.
You may ask why I would say that?
Because the Jesus of the world, is only a man. Actually, your view is not unlike that of innumerable persons throughout the ages. It certainly is consistant with the beliefs of some religious groups as you recognize.
It is particularly an islamic belief.
Nonetheless, Jesus, though denied having existed by some, is almost always thought of being an historical person, a man only, not unlike anyone else. A unique man, perhaps having a spark of divinity, but not divine.
I offer the following quote.

"This fact, however, does not necessitate that Jesus is divine in essence or spirit, nor is he worthy of worship, for Adam’s existence was more miraculous than that of Jesus".

http://www.islamreligion.com/articles/31/viewall/

According to quran, allah is recorded as remarking thus:

"Behold! I taught you the Book and Wisdom, the Torah and the Gospel". ( quran 5.110 )

I want you to consider dikhr (remembrance of God ) and remember as is required of you quran 5.110 because allah either did this thing as recorded, or he did not. I can say this is a true saying, without saying the quran is true. But Mayada, you are required to believe it, and I request you to say you do.
I do not hate you Mayada. I do not hate muslims. I believe you are very sincere. I believe you pray. I believe you encourage persons to be the best they might be. I believe you have admirable qualities that are desireable to be emulated. I believe you are charitable. But you lack a saving knowledge of The Christ and as such are a partaker of the sins of evil men ,for you have not believed God's report, therefore making Him a liar.
You are being given that opportunity.
I am more than happy to be a friend and am pleased to be so if you will allow it. In any case you shall remain dear to my heart.

God Bless you, Mayada.

But again, how is it that Abraham's servant behaved himself in such a manner, when islamic proscriptions disallow everything he did? How could Abimilech know that Abraham was " sporting " with Rebekah ? He not know the fair woman he was looking upon sporting with Abraham, was indeed the same one Abraham introduced as his sister. Why would Rebekah cause men to lust after her by revealing her beauty, if indeed she was muslim?
Why wasn't she veiled when the men of Gerar looked upon her?
It is not that I don't understand islam, I will read the quran with you page by page should you desire.

BTW, I am not catholic, so, what a nun should wear or not wear, is of little significance to me. But you must acknowledge that should they fail in the presumed requirement of wearing a habit, they would not be victim of the religious police. At least not in this day and age. Most all of such requirements are laws of men only and as such arise out of corrupting influences not necessarily unlawful ones.

Respectfully,

Gran'pa

gran'pa said...

It is disturbing to me dear Mayada, that such a gulf may exist as to make communication virtually impossible if not extremely difficult. You may be aware of a habit all of us are guilty of, that of forming our answers while as yet the other is speaking, making us less unable to hear what is being said. That is why printed communication is good. We can go back and reread remarks that have been made and be more able to understand what is being said.

I regret that I have offended you with the term " bagged up ".

When I observed that dear soul being executed, she first looked to her right and then to her left, in anticipation and dread of the executioner, before he ended her life in a burst of gunfire.

I too am offended.

You might say that she deserved her horrific end, but the fact that this poor soul was shrouded from the eyes of the world, so much so that we can not discern her appearance, is deeply distrbing to me. Would you suggest I show this to any of my daughters or my young men?

I do not bear any malice toward you, nor do I find fault with you that I should not interact with you, but there are a number of things that I do object to regarding islam.

I can object to islam, without rejecting you. Perhaps the obvious icon that most causes suspicion, or warrants concern to me, are the " crossed swords " of islam. Are they because the Christians and Jews do not like you? Are the " crossed swords " a reminder to the kafir, persons other than Christians and Jews, to be a little more mindful and show some respect? Or are they to remind the muslim that everthing they have came from struggle and oppression and it was necesssary to be armed and valiant, and slay the oppressor?

Are you familiar with the story of Cain and Abel. You say Adam and Eve were muslim ( by implication of your belief ), but were Cain and Abel muslim too?

As a final note, the Word of God says, " Let no man say when he is tempted , I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: But every man is tempted , when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed . Then when lust hath conceived , it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished , bringeth forth death ".

I include the previous because it appears you have been brought to believe that women, being the " objects of lust they are" , are responsible for the intentions and acts of men who may be evil minded toward them. On a personal level, I don't buy that.

We have so much to speak to one another about. I hope that you find in me an eager friend who can accept you. You know I disagree with you and I acknowledge that you disagree with me.

Importantly, both of us can agree, " Shall not the Judge of all the earth shall do right.

And that dear Mayada,is the Word of God.

Gran'pa

gran'pa said...

This may be a double post, wish I had a better system! Sorry.

Dear Mayada,

I want to take a moment and share a concern that is foremost in my mind and that is regarding persons who upon learning that their faith is unfounded, cast off any opportunity to know God or confess the least desire to know God in a personal sense. By personal, I mean that one should be called a " friend of God ".
As a muslim, you should know that Abraham was called God's friend in The Book.
To give you example, of such casting off, the WatchTower Society, believes much as you do, that Jesus is a man only, born of a virgin, certainly a unique entry into this world of the flesh. The WatchTower Society also has a very high rate of persons who become disallusioned and leave the society, or are purposely disfellowshipped if they become questioning, and fail to follow the dictates of Scriptural understanding or correction from their leaders and congregational servants. Often, once a person leaves the WatchTower Society, they become bereft of any faith or confidence in God, because they have been indoctrinated into the belief they really have no other place to go. Too, they are shunned by anyone they may have had close association with by order of the society.
Why I am sharing this with you is because, in spite of the revealed Word of God, and I am speaking of The Book and The Torah, I don't think that you can see yourself as a " friend " of God. And indeed, should you do so, just exactly how would a friend of God behave ?
I am pleased that we have had the opportunity to get to know one another over these past few days, and I hope that we can continue to correspond.
I know ths may be uncomfortable for you, but I detect in you an honorable bearing, and am confident that irrespective of what you may think of me, we can be open and honest with one another.
Mayada, the only limiting factor is , do you consider me a " shayten "? That would certainly create a condition that would be difficult to overcome.
Jesus was accused of working miracles by the power of the devil, so it is easy to think that the concern may be in the back of your mind that I am of the devil because of the words I speak to you.
This is where I believe we should begin our journey together, in the person of Christ. In a sense, we have already done that. Both of us look to Jesus as having been informed of God, and I in particular believe indeed that His understanding of The Word of God, is from the Father above. I will take the time to refresh you on the passage having been quoted before:

"Behold! I taught you the Book and Wisdom, the Torah and the Gospel". ( quran 5.110 )

I believe that Jesus was taught, and had a command of The Word of God that caused the men and women who heard Him to marvel.

There is one really, really big question that I am hoping that you will ask, and it has to do with the Jesus of the Gospel. BTW, the Gospel is the reconcilling of the world to Himself by God, through a work that only God can do. It was acknowledged in the form of an accusation against the Lord and goes thus:
" Why doth this man thus speak blasphemies? who can forgive sins but God only "?

Your friend,

Gran'pa

gran'pa said...

Dear Mayada,

I am dismayed. I certainly hope it is your duties and other obligations that have prevented you from responding.
In my prior post, I see that I spelled " Shaitan " wrong. My error.
The reason I go directly to that error is because I am afraid I may have alarmed you?
Necessarily, both for my benefit and yours, can you explain to me how persons such as ourselves are able to have meaningful dialogue, especially so when the topic quite possibly may provoke antagonism? That is what I am thinking now, that you are either offended, angry, or have become hostile in your thoughts toward things I have said.
As a student of comparative religions, I think that you would welcome an unbiased discussion with someone not of your belief, unbiased because even as you disagree with me, I can view your faith in islam more objectively.
I will give you an example. Deborah. Deborah was a judge of Israel. The account of her service is recorded in The Book in Judges 4. She was a prophetess and accurately foretold the deliverance of Sisera into the hand of a woman. She was a woman approved of God Almighty.
Why doesn't the quran speak of Deborah? It speaks of Mary, it speaks of the wife of Pharaoh, it speaks of Aisha, but never of Deborah. Her account is found in The Book, which allah says is kept in remembrance according to your quran.
But most importantly, given Deborah"s considered importance, and even that of others such as Sarah, and Ruth, and Esther, how is it that the prophet of allah can be quoted thus:

Book 031, Number 5966:

Abu Musa reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying:" There are many persons amongst men who are quite perfect but there are not perfect amongst women except Mary, daughter of 'Imran, Asiya wife of Pharaoh, and the excellence of 'A'isha as compared to women is that of Tharid over all other foods ".

Many perfect men?

And:

Volume 1, Book 6, Number 301:

Narrated Abu Said Al-Khudri:

Once Allah's Apostle went out to the Musalla (to offer the prayer) o 'Id-al-Adha or Al-Fitr prayer. Then he passed by the women and said, "O women! Give alms, as I have seen that the majority of the dwellers of Hell-fire were you (women)." They asked, "Why is it so, O Allah's Apostle ?" He replied, "You curse frequently and are ungrateful to your husbands. I have not seen anyone more deficient in intelligence and religion than you. A cautious sensible man could be led astray by some of you." The women asked, "O Allah's Apostle! What is deficient in our intelligence and religion?" He said, "Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man?" They replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her intelligence. Isn't it true that a woman can neither pray nor fast during her menses?" The women replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her religion."

Deficient, in her intelligence and religion? Most inhabitants in hell are women?

Mayada, The Book accounts that:


The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked : who can know it?
Jeremiah 17:9 KJV


Dear, Dear Mayada, this is not to incite jealousy in you but to open your eyes to the record of The Book, which is the Word of God Almighty.

You must make a distinction between what the Lord has revealed, and the purposeful, and slanderous remarks of a man who believed of himself that he was a prophet of allah and is blindly followed to this day.

God Bless you, Mayada.

I will at least speak truthfully with you. I am not meaning to be unkind.

Your friend,

Gran'pa

Mayada M. said...

Dear "Gran'pa",

I do not wish to offend you, but where... in ANY of my comments, posts, and remarks did you get the notion that I think you are a "Shayton," (Devil)???

By far, that is a wild allegation, and you are quite wrongly mistaken. Nowhere in anything I have said to you have I made even the slightest remark that I think such a thing.

Beyond that, you made many remarks that I would like to address, however, now is not a time where I can answer you completely.

Please, continue to post if you wish, but I would appreciate your patiences as I am still observing Ramadan, preparing to go back to school, & blessed with my first pregnancy.

gran'pa said...

Dear Mayada,

Congratulations. Both my wife and I are excited for you. You will find that young people grow up much too fast. It seems like yesterday that ours were little ones that required their every need cared for. Now they are grown and have children of their own. Time passes so quickly. Be sure to savor the moments with your little one and keep the little treasures brought to you for remembrance and warming of the heart when older.
You are so young, little one. I say that as a term of affection and not to be disrespectful. I call my girls yet by that term, and nothing is intentioned by it to demean you.
This is to assure you, I am not offended by any of your remarks, and never have you offended me.I wish to say also that my comment about being a" Shaitan " was not an allegation. I know about jinn and I know too, that notions people may hold or entertain can interfere in interpersonal relationships. I do not want that.
So, I will hope that you may agree that it was a misunderstanding on your part, that I thought that of you. And, I would hope that any others who have read these posts understand too, that I made no such allegation, but expressed a concern.
I had a muslim friend some years ago who is now dead. It was very important to be cautious around him because he could become very agitated at what were otherwise remarks not meant to offend, but to develop a greater understanding of who he was as a person and what similarities existed between us. I lost touch with him unfortunately and did not hear from him for some time and then came across his obituary in the newspaper. Interestingly, it mentioned that he died on Christmas Day. There was no question that he and I believed in a different Jesus, so I couldn't help consider the irony in the announcement. Perhaps, after all our discussions, it was a way of affirming that he had come to know the Lord Jesus Christ. I don't know, but I hope so.
In any event, again, enjoy your pregnancy. There will be difficult moments but you will get through them. My wife always chided me that I could not know what it is like to be pregnant but at the same time she shares with me special moments about times when she was carrying the children. Private things, womanly things, I guess we as men cannot understand . It is always exciting when they are delivered.
God bless and keep you and your family.

Your friend,

Gran'pa

Melissa said...

The my god is better than your god answer... what's new... you would think with so much confusion, one of them would end the debate and speak for themself, instead of having fundies on both sides lie all the time.

It is funny to me that the more religious a group is, the more violence and hatred flow from said group...

gran'pa said...

Melissa,

Just what lie or lies are you talking about? And, "fundies", what exactly do you mean? I am a little skeptical about why you posted in the manner you did, and am unsure of your motive if any. Specifically, what violent groups are you talking about?

Mayada M. said...

Hello "Gran'pa",

Just wanted to let you know that I haven't forgotten about getting back to your questions! :)

I am currently 5 months pregnant, and a full time student, & wife, very busy lol!

But I will do my best to answer as many questions as I possibly can as soon as I can :)

gran'pa said...

Dear Mayada,

5 months along! You will be amazed how quickly the last 4 will pass. It seems like yesterday that our new granddaughter was born and now she is 6 months old.
I am looking forward to your reply and if you might consider it, could you think upon one more question that is perhaps singularly important?
Why is it that The Book, The Law and The Prophets, of which ( by the testimony of islam ) was delivered to men as a guide and a remembrance, tells us that Messiah is to fight and destroy muslim nations? I am speaking of Babylon ( Iraq and Arabia ), Assyria, Cush ( Sudan ) Egypt, and Tyre (Lebanon ) to name a few? This is precisely why I believe you have been kept purposely ignorant that you should say allah and Jehovah are the same, for indeed, they cannot be.
Now, please understand dear Mayada, that I am not wishing to injure you or cause you hurt, but the above is a very important question. And too, I want you to know that I believe you are a very capable young woman, intelligent, and well ordered in your habits, but I am afraid that we cannot have an informed conversation because of certain limiting conditions.
Melissa made several accusations which were so broad as to be unintelligible. No information was given to even begin to respond. I have seen this behavior many times before and seriously question if she indeed wants an answer?
But, to use information wisely, it is necessary to use what has been presented for our examination. I have both Bibles, and quran. I have concordances and extensive sources at my disposal as do both she and you. But shall they be used or even contemplated?
I guess in closing, what I am saying is, there is a danger that we may turn to the match that has been struck believing it to illuminate the sun. Obviously, in this case, the consequences may be severe if we fail to properly acknowledge sources and motives.
Most people do not know me as a " Bible thumper " but I am firmly convinced at the end of the day, the great gulf shall be revealed and the distinction between Saved and Lost will forever be known to all who have been given opportunity by the Just One.
God bless you and your child, Mayada, may His light be revealed both in you and your household.

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

I am pleased to hear from you. This may be a double post as has happened in the past. Posting is presenting a problem. I don't understand the technical side of these things and so it can be a little distracting when they don't behave as anticipated.

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

Hope you are well.
Can persons smile at someone and have contempt for them at the same time?
I believe there are people in this world that can do that?
Do you believe that also?
I know you state reasons for being quiet from this post.
You are kept in my remembrances.


Gran'pa

truth said...

donation made receipt ending 2808 TO Answering Islam- Shamoun. keep up the good work guys

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

Are you well?

BB said...

Now I've only skimmed your content, but from what I see, your a Christian. Christianity is no different than Islam. Books have changed over the years, people have been murdered in the name of the Christian God, men beat their wives because it states it in the Bible, worship of false god(Jesus) is common practice, etc. Do not point out flaws of one religion without pointing out the flaws in your own. The story of Mariam shows that it doesn't matter what religion you are--just have faith and always do good. Islam wasn't intended on being a separate religion, it was supposed to mean the way of the prophets or a peaceful way of living much like the teachings of Buddah. I know that the book has been changed. Many of us have witnessed it during the time of the brotherhood getting rid of old texts in some of our old libraries. This has happened to Christianity as well. Just because some MAN wrote it down doesn't make it holy--including the Bible and Torah. I was raised both Catholic and Muslim. I have no bias to any religion and realize that no matter what's written, people will find evil in it. Embrace those who are good. My parents found unity and yet we went to Mass on Wednesday and Friday prayer at the Mosque. Find the similarities within each other and move past the differences. There's a Christian church in the area that also shares their space with Muslims. Hmm... my parents weren't the only ones. Although I saw you say that your freedoms in Michigan were taken away. Well that's anywhere. My brother was put all over the news as a wanted terrorist. When he went in to clear up the mix up, they arrested him. Now these were prejudice Christians looking to take down any Muslim in their area. He was raised here with dual beliefs his whole life. Now obviously they had to let him go, but they took away weeks of his life and nothing can be done about it. I agree with some things you state but my only problem is that you state "In Jesus' precious name amen" Your no different than any Muslim who can't be free from the brainwashing and stop to realize God's true message. Just be good and believe in only one god. You did exactly what you say Muslim's do with Muhammad by making that statement.

gran'pa said...

@BB

I have not seen you post here before. Who exactly are you addressing as a Christian? What prior post are you referring to, by whom? And, are you willing to agree to certain precepts that avoid the " brainwashing " label?
It is always saddening to me to see posts such as yours because there appears to be a purposeful disregarding of objectivity.
What I have said is not meant to anger you, it is a personal observation however valid it might be. And, I am not saying that it does not remain to be seen as valid or not.
I am looking forward to your reply.

Gran'pa

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

I've been stretching out the hand here. Are you well? How are you coming along in your pregnancy. Our little granddaughter is a blessing. I am always amazed to see the love poured out on her by her mother. It is a beautiful thing to watch. I am hoping you experience the same joy.
Keeping you in my remembrances.

Gran'pa

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

I am thinking something is wrong?
I hope you are well.
I am keeping you in my remembrances.

Gran’pa

B said...

After watching the footage presented, my concern has nothing to do with the various arguments for or against any religion, but the pure and simple violation of the law, and the evident complicity of the lawfully appointed police officers who refused to enforce the law of the land.
Such blatant disregard for the law of the land can only lead to trouble.

Luq07 said...

I'm just curious after reading your FAQ. What does the word "Allah" mean? What does the word "Fitnah" mean? Who are the "People of the Book"? If Islam is so against Christians, why is there a full chapter in the Quran on Mary? And a full chapter on Jesus? And if, as you claim, Muslims are raising the Prophet Muhammed to the level of Godhood, what do you think Christians did? Please show me the quote in the Bible from Jesus where he says he is God's only Son. And don't quote the "Father, forgive them for they know not what they do" quote because that doesn't say "I am the Son of God" since Christians also say, "Our Father, who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name..." which implies we are all God's children. I'd appreciate an answer. Thanks!

gran'pa said...

@Luq07
" Please show me the quote in the Bible from Jesus where he says he is God's only Son ".

Lug, it was said of Him by witnesses at His crucifixion.
" He trusted in God; let him deliver him now, if he will have him: for he said , I am the Son of God .

If I had any confidence that you were sincere, I might be more willing to share some additional insights that you may find helpful.

As with any narrative, you need to develop a certain confidence in witnesses or at least consider that they either knew what they were talking about, or they were in a state of confusion and not worthy of consideration. It is principled observation in a court of law that witnesses must be truthful, and in our system must swear or affirm that they are telling the truth.
Because we cannot " haul " these people into court, it is then necessary to decide if only for ourselves, whether we shall find the many testimonies in the Gospels credible enough to believe them.
Remember, not only was He acknowledged as being the Son of God, but was also scorned and held in contempt for that same cause,. He was wickedly maligned even as He gave His life for us upon the cruel Cross.
The Jews in John 10 asked Him a question most intriguing to them and because of their concern were about to stone Him. And this was His answer:
" Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified , and sent into the world *, Thou blasphemest ; because I said , I am the Son of God? If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not. But if I do , though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know , and believe , that the Father is in me, and I in him ".
If you have any familiarity with the Word of God, the Jewish Tanakh, and the Gospels, you will understand that much is there to confirm the significance of the person of Christ.
Today, often He is held in contempt and ridicule not unlike those years ago when He was present among us. You need not read far, and you will see the swirling controversy and many mocking statements made of Him.
But what is your purpose in asking the question? Indeed, if you wish to know, then you must do as the Lord Himself commanded.
Before you can do that however, you must come to the source of the Revelation of God, which is His Word. And should you not do that, then there are innumerable testimonies and witnesses available to you that bring it to you. In any case, if it is only that you lack faith, then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God.
Does God speak to us? Assuredly.
Else He would be neither just or righteous as spoken of Him in the Scriptures and believed across the centuries.
In closing, a final witness again comes from the Jew. "Then said they all, Art thou then the Son of God? And he said unto them, Ye say that I am . And they said , What need we any further witness? for we ourselves have heard of his own mouth ".
His remark to them that " ye say that I am, was affirming what they were saying of Him and were intentioned to kill Him for. And that because of their unbelief.

Gran'pa

gran'pa said...

Part 1 of 2 pages.

@Luq07
"Please show me the quote in the Bible from Jesus where he says he is God's only Son".
Lug, it was said of Him by witnesses at His crucifixion.
" He trusted in God; let him deliver him now, if he will have him: for he said , I am the Son of God .
Should I have confidence that you were sincere, I might be more willing to share some additional insights that you may find helpful.
As with any narrative, you need to develop a certain confidence in witnesses or at least consider that they either knew what they were talking about, or they were in a state of confusion and not worthy of consideration. It is principled observation in a court of law that witnesses must be truthful, and in our system must swear or affirm that they are telling the truth.
Because we cannot " haul " these people into court, it is then necessary to decide if only for ourselves, whether we shall find the many testimonies in the Gospels credible enough to believe them.

gran'pa said...

@ Lug07 Part 2

Continuing from the previous post:


Remember, not only was He acknowledged as being The Son of God, but was also scorned and held in contempt for that same cause,. He was wickedly maligned even as He gave His life for us upon the cruel Cross.
The Jews in John 10 asked Him a question most intriguing to them and because of their concern, were about to stone Him. And He answered:
" Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified , and sent into the world *, Thou blasphemest ; because I said , I am the Son of God? If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not. But if I do , though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know , and believe , that the Father is in me, and I in him ".
If you have any familiarity with the Word of God, the Jewish Tanakh, and the Gospels, you will understand that much is there to confirm the significance of the person of Christ. Too, people believed and knew God long before anything was written of Him.
Today, Jesus is yet held in contempt and ridicule not unlike those years ago when He was present among us. You need not read far, and you will see the swirling controversy and many mocking statements surrounding and about Him.
But what is your purpose in asking the question? Indeed, if you wish to know, then you must do as the Lord Himself commanded.
Before you can do that however, you must come to the source of the Revelation of God, which is His Word. And should you not do that, then there are innumerable testimonies and witnesses available to you that bring His Word to you. In any case, if it is only that you lack faith, then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God.
Does God speak to us? Assuredly, else He would be neither just or righteous as spoken of Him in the Scriptures and believed across the centuries.
In closing, a final witness again comes from the Jew. "Then said they all, Art thou then the Son of God? And he said unto them, Ye say that I am . And they said , What need we any further witness? for we ourselves have heard of his own mouth ".
His remark to them that " ye say that I am, was affirming what they were saying of Him and were intentioned to kill Him for. And that because of their unbelief.

Gran'pa

gran'pa said...

Dear, Dear Mayada,

Are you well ?
Have you been prohibited from coming here?
How is your pregnancy going?
You are kept in our remembrances.

Gran'pa

gran'pa said...

@Lug07,

" And don't quote the "Father, forgive them for they know not what they do" quote because that doesn't say "I am the Son of God" since Christians also say, "Our Father, who art in heaven, hallowed be thy name..." which implies we are all God's children. I'd appreciate an answer. Thanks "!

Why not quote that?

It was said by the Lord, who is the Author of the Christian Church.

It was not said by one outside of grace of which He said, " Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do . He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it ".

In both instances, it was the same speaker, the Lord Jesus Christ.
I am always amazed how persons can decide for themselves which rules apply, when speaking of the Lordship of Jesus, the very Son of God.

Do you even know what it is you said?

Gran'pa

the green said...

Hello,

A lot of valid points raised here, but is it really fair to group all sects, ie. Sunni, Shia... etc and the Ahmadis in one? We all know the "whole" Muslim UMMA has declared Ahmadis as non-Muslims(under who's authority i wonder) and hate us with a vengeance... and we are also the only ones who reject violent Jihaad completely and encourage intelligent dialogue (meaning mainstreams fundees need no apply).

Otherwise nothing more to add really.

Thanks

the Green Sprite

John said...

Mayada,

Are you yet there? Are you prevented from accessing this site?

Gran'pa

Blogger said...

"That they said (in boast), 'We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah'; but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was MADE to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not." 4:157

Accoring to the language used in this verse, the Jews didn't deceive themselves, Allah deceived them. Note the "it was made to appear to them", rather than "the jews made it appear to themselves." Why would Allah deceive all those Jews? Why would he deceive them when they wrote the Gospels? Any god that does that is Satan, not God.

When I read the koran, it became clear to me that the oft repeated line: "Allah has placed a seal on the hearts of the non-muslims" was yet another piece of deception. Allah has placed a seal on the hearts of the MUSLIMS so they can't "see" what normal, rational people see.

Dennis said...

How many Korans have been burned by Islamic Suicide Bombers?

Are Islamic Suicide Bombers the only ones allowed to burn the Koran?

Allwyn de almeida said...

@ Vagabond, Vishwanath Gaitondhe - If you have ever watched Dr. Zakir Naik's Videos, you will clearly understand that he has a condescending attitude towards non-believers of Allah, and later on he says to the Christians that I am a true Christian and follow Christ more than you. Clearly William Campbell was defeated, however, I am sure that it will be great to see Dr. Naik debate with Jay Smith, Nabeel Qureshi and Mr. Wood. Islam says that it is a defensive Religion, I say that (the one who are attacking Islam) would have accepted Christ as their Savior, would not even attack Muslims, and also the Muslims will have to accept Christ as their Savior, so that they do not have to be Offensive to be defensive.

You might wanna read these versus from the Koran (3: 3, 4, 48, 65*) (3: 48, 49*) (3: 55; 4:158*) (5: 46*) (5: 66*) (5: 110*) Read these versus from the Koran, at least the Koran has got some truth. YOU WILL GET TO KNOW THE TRUTH.

Thank you Jesus for you have sent your Only Son on Earth to die for us so that we shall be saved. It is an amazing to be a follower of Christ!!!

aaron said...

here is a suggestion, wait till Zakir Naik comes to US then crash at his presentation or get someone talking to you by phone and also a good presenter and question Naik on his stuff. this means he can;t avoid you because he doesn;t see you there.DO this near the end and drop the payload at him. also gives time to look up on stuff if he says anything false too. If he doesn;t come to you,you go to him

Doug said...

Hi David, I quite like you're approach to the videos although I haven't watched the debates.
I don't know if you have indicated it or not but I was wondering what translation of the Quron you are using and what alternative translations are available.
I had a short discussion with a friend who had read a Quron and he doesn't remember some of the issues you have brought up in your reading and so the question.

MikeyMikati said...

Hello David,

I can answer all your questions in 3 simple facts about Islam:

1) The Qur'an is a book to be pondered, and how one decides to interpret is up to him/her. Sure, we have the Hadith to further give accounts of the Prophet's life and deeper interpretations, but a fact is a fact: We as Muslims can translate as we wish despite some basic given rules of Islam (i.e. the 5 pillars, and 6 basic beliefs). NONE in which speak of war, violence, hatred, etc.
2) The Qur'an was revealed to Prophet Mohammed (pbuh)during a specific time, for a specific people and for a specific purpose. The beauty of this, is that we in PRESENT DAY can read these stories and interpret or be given a divine message (Most of the time). And Most of the time this is in Spiritual context, not literal or physical.
3) Last but not least, (and speaking if context) Anyone can do what you do, to almost any literature. Let's take the Bible for example. Singling out verses, taking them out of context, finding what seem to be contradictions from one area to the next, etc. This is all OVER the Bible...You should try to remove yourself from your physical limitations, open your mind and heart, stop trying to bash the faith of 1.5 Billion people, and just Love...again...JUST Love...afterall, all of this is exactly what Jesus, Mohammed and all the Prophets (may peace be with them all) tried to teach...if you don't see this...then you JUST DON'T GET IT....and I will pray for you...Good Luck Brother.

oscar said...

Please join our international community which supports Alexander Aan's human rights, an Indonesian freethinker who got beaten and thrown in to the jail because questioned the existence of god and criticized Islam. Join us by pressing "Like" on our Facebook page http://www.facebook.com/pages/Support-Alex-Aans-Human-Rights/194025204028128?sk=info

Andes said...

Who deceived themselves that Jesus was crucified? The non Jewish believers who wanted Him dead, His twelve disciples who followed Him and hid after watching His crucifixion out of fear of the authorities because they were in disbelief that the person whom they had followed was now murdered before their own eyes and feared that they may suffer the same fate. Perhaps it was the thousands of people who had listened to Him teaching and where mortified that the same person was now been flogged and made to carry His own cross before their own eyes. Or perhaps the women that followed Him and where looking up at the cross watching His life drain from His body. Where they delusional to visit a grave of a living man. His own mother could never have confused the man hanging on the cross with someone else. Could it have been the Romans that where in fact driving the nails thru His hand and feet while mocking Him. Not all the Jews did not want to believe that Jesus was the Messiah; even today there are those that do believe He is the Messiah. This statement is completely inaccurate. External Non Jewish Bible sources speak of His crucifixion, the Bible which has not been corrupted has far too many eye witness accounts of the event having taken place.

Andes said...

There is a big difference into deceiving yourself and someone been deceived. It would be incredibly difficult however to witness something with your own eyes and then deceive yourself or for someone to deceive you that in fact what you are looking at is not real. The crucifixion of Jesus is backed by eye witness accounts. It is not based on one man’s word. It is based on thousands of eye witness accounts both within the Bible and from evidence from outside the Bible. The only book refuting this fact is the Quran which claims that one man received the word. This fact cannot be verified as his account of things has to be believed. No one can verify that he indeed did receive any word. If he did receive the word that that the Romans where not crucifying Jesus but someone else then explain how did they manage to deceive the disciples that it was not Jesus standing in the courtyard before His judges, or that the very person been flogged was not Jesus, did he sound like Jesus but wasn’t Jesus, did He look like Jesus with the cross of thorns on His head but He wasn’t Jesus. The Quran doesn’t refute the fact that a crucifixion had taken place but rather that someone else was crucified and not Jesus. How do you deceive thousands of people into believing the person they are looking at is not Jesus. Unless you have today’s media and plastics surgeons they would never been able to achieve this. You gullibly just believe without questioning. The Bible clearly states that every single word must be refuted and tested. This way you can test what you believe in. Muslims just tend to allow themselves to be deceived and blindly follow what the Quran states. This is just plain ludicrous and this is how you allow yourself to be deceived. Muslims have not deceived themselves that crucifixion did not take place but rather they have allowed themselves to be deceived by the very book they consider to be Holy. They except that The Quran is the word of God without questioning the very teachings or words of the Quran.

Andes said...

Eveyone must keep in mind when posting. God hates the sin not the sinner. Do not ridicule people but rather debate their belief and help them see the error in their belief.

Esra said...

I want to ask why the jewes and the Christians never use there minds actually Islam is the truth not because of anything its just because they respect the whole messengers of God " Jesus, Moses , Mohamed, Jacob, Abraham, Isaac and all the others because they are all Gods messengers as Mohamed they all came to protect humans and show them the right way of idolizing God but Mohamed was the last that so you can't see a Muslim who say bad words for any of these messengers even Jesus and Moses but u can see Christians and Jewes who say bad words about Mohamed weird they say we are Gods people and they refuses his messengers so please read and read the really real and then talk because God will ask us in the last day about what we say so be careful

Blogger said...

>Christians never use there minds

I don't know what you mean by this. The New Testament repeatedly calls for humans to use their brains, not submit to mindless rules or legalism. Islam, OTOH, is about 'submission', and at times the going against of rationality.

>refuses his messengers

Many, many people have claimed to be prophets since Jesus time, and Jesus warned us against these false prophets saying they are wolvs in sheeps clothing. The description fits Muhammad perfectly, as he claimed he was a prophet (sheep clothing) but was a ruthless cruel mass murderer, robber, paedophile and lecher. How can you say you use your brain while at the same time calling this man a prophet, and worse still, likening him to Jesus?! Read what Muhammad really did. The story that revolts me the most is the stoning of the young single mother who was obviously depressed and ostracised.

Yes, one day you will stand in heaven and you will be asked why you called a mass murderer a 'prophet of God".

joe said...

Thank you Blogger,
You have said the Truth, AT LAST!
How can anybody even without full mental capabilities declare that the murderer, evil, rapist and disgusting mahmud was a prophet or anything to do with declaring the word of GOD, is beyond normal understanding. This lecherous, looting, warmonger hypocryte created a "religion" by copying tenets and sayings from the Scriptures and added a few of his own fantasies by dictating to his cronies as he was illiterate. He was a false prophet (as the Messiah stated there would be), he established a dynasty of thieves and cruel murderers that continues today. It is a scandal and an abomination that this rubbish still exists in this planet. Millions of unhappy, dissatisfied muslims are leaving the nest forever enery year. It was a tiresome task by "Gran'pa" to have written so diligently and kindly to that "intelligent" woman to try and make her understand the basics of THE religion, some of these people are very obtuse and stupid they will never comprehend and renounce islam. Another reason is because they are dominated by other forces, be it their family, husbands, or those cretinous and politically powerful preachers of hate, the mullahs. Also some are comfortably off aided or dominated by powerful organizations that have oil money behind them. These people/organisations just want power, they will brainwash/force naive young people to kill or get killed for a non existing "holy" cause promising them "sexual joy" in paradise. Can you believe it? It's the dark ages again, but even blacker. This is not the work of a "prophet", but of a far baser creature, one reeking of sulphur.

Mayada M. said...

Dear Joe,

I am sorry, but you are sadly mistaken. I don't even know where to begin as your comprehension of Islam and "YOUR" fantasies are wildly bewildered. I find it unfortunate that people keep finding themselves to propaganda & hate websites. And even more upsetting that I am back giving such sites hits on their site counter. It makes me wonder what must be boiling up inside their souls to have built so many dark emotions around ones own worship towards God. I almost feel compelled to mention that if your going to make such bold statement, at least run theme by credible sources. I'm sure your a bright man, and I'm in no place to judge, nor believe that I am "smarter," but sometimes good people make bad cases for themselves. I'd be willing to have a respectful and open conversation if your willing to go the extra mile to learn; as grand'pa and I previously engaged in. However I won't tolerate further personal insults.

p.s.
My "dominate" force is God, not man. Be it if a woman respects her husband, she is doing it for the sake of God. I am a VERY satisfied woman who happens to be Muslim.

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

How extraordinary! I have not been here for the longest time and am pleasantly surprised to find you here. You have never been far from my thoughts. How is mother and child doing? I have two new grandchildren that are blessings indeed.

s said...

Hi David,

I'm pretty new to learning how to engage in apologetics with muslims. Are there any books or resources which you would recommend?

Thanks

gran'pa said...

@S,

Know your Bible.
Know the quran, the sira of mohammed, the hadiths, and become familiar with the “reliance of the traveler.”
David slew Goliath by removing Goliath’s head with Goliath’s own sword.
What is often overlooked is that Goliath had 4 brothers, one of which is named and the others alluded to.
Each presented their own threat. All were killed, either by David, or the soldiers of David.

Don said...

thank god i can get both the hadiths and the koran for free online. also i have found some free online unedited version of the sirat of ibn kathr; but i am looking for the other sirats as well as history al tabari for free online.
where can i get it?





9by the way i am studying islam and the their sources for quite some time now, for my credentials in apologetism)

i_am_me said...

@David, Nabeel, John, and everyone at acts17...

This is a very great blog. During my travel around any Islam-Christian "relation" sites around the net, i found your works here is better since (i think) u guys open up more for people from the islamic faith to debate your knowledge and faith. Well atleast this is from my current view, based on my very limited exploring to the topics (threads) available here. I hope this will always be my view on your works. God Bless all of you, always.

@Mayada
your writings here is also an "eye opening" for me, sincerely i never met a Moslem with love, knowledge, and patients as amazing as i see in your replies at this FAQ section. You even answered a question that i've been wondered for so long regarding Avraham (Abraham or Ibrahim) in the Islamic, a question that i cant seem to even ask at my country without have to worry about getting harassed or possibly killed here (yes, i live in an Islam majority country, and yes those who "offended" Islam very much likely will get those kind of result i mention before). And regarding your answer that said "a Moslem is basically everyone who believe Yhwh or Allah as the One True God", i've been wondering about this statement is it also mean that all Jews and Christians is actually a Moslem in Islamic views? if its so then does it mean that any Moslem can go to Church or Synagogue to pray? oh if you question my motives, i can assure u that i only seek nothing but the truth, no hidden agenda :) thankyou for your reply. Assalamualaikum WRWB.

Saumya said...

Muslims are Good!!!
According to you, Muslims are good (may be); but not in this world, might be in another universe.

dinesh said...

muslims and islam is a faith based on pure greed and selfishness, this is why more muslims are killing each other then ever before, muslims bring corruption, inbreeeding and poverty, another proven fact, whenever a muslim moves into area it very quickly becomes a filthy slum

LORD IS MY SAVIOUR said...

I am a Christian by the grace of GOD
if the Muslims want sharia law in western countries why don't they move to Muslim countries such as Saudi Arabia and other Muslim countries.why they are destroying the western culture they are not the masters of the world we all will be judged by our own acts they should be worried about their own Muslim brothers who are killing innocent humans in the name of jihad.If as a Muslim you hate western countries there is no reason to remain the citizen of these countries.You all took the oath under the law of the country then why do you want to change the laws for the sake of your religion.

LORD IS MY SAVIOUR said...

Is the Islam giving equal rights to women as men?

Mayada M. said...

@i_am_me,

Thank you for your kind words! This approach is the way people of different faiths and cultures should approach each other. Hostility gets you no where, it only confirms to the opposite side their already negative feelings of that group. Your entitled to your beliefs but they should be founded on evidence. A lot of the arguments on this page lose me because it isn't for enlightenment but pure hateful banter. People on here should keep in mind that the second largest religious group in the world is Islam. And it spreads across every continent and almost every country in the world.

To answer your question- to Muslims, every where on earth is Gods land, and it is not forbidden for any man. Thus Muslim's may pray in a Church or in a Synagogue. Ideally anywhere one chooses to pray should be clean. One would not choose to pray in a pig pen for it would soil thier clothes. However as you may already know wherever a Muslim chooses to pray, we pray facing the Mecca in Saudi Arabia because it is where God ordered Abraham to build the black stone (Kaaba), and face to pray. To Muslims thisis a polar point to God and the heavens.

Mayada M. said...

@i_am_me,

Thank you for your kind words! This approach is the way people of different faiths and cultures should approach each other. Hostility gets you no where, it only confirms to the opposite side their already negative feelings of that group. Your entitled to your beliefs but they should be founded on evidence. A lot of the arguments on this page lose me because it isn't for enlightenment but pure hateful banter. People on here should keep in mind that the second largest religious group in the world is Islam. And it spreads across every continent and almost every country in the world.

To answer your question- to Muslims, every where on earth is Gods land, and it is not forbidden for any man. Thus Muslim's may pray in a Church or in a Synagogue. Ideally anywhere one chooses to pray should be clean. One would not choose to pray in a pig pen for it would soil thier clothes. However as you may already know wherever a Muslim chooses to pray, we pray facing the Mecca in Saudi Arabia because it is where God ordered Abraham to build the black stone (Kaaba), and face to pray. To Muslims thisis a polar point to God and the heavens.

gran'pa said...

Mayada,
Where did you get you information that God told Abraham (A Hebrew Biblical character) to pray facing Mecca?

Mayada M. said...

Hello Gran'pa,

Here is the answer to your question.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bakkah

It is mentioned in the Qur'an Hadith/ Sunnah, Torah and the Bible.

Prophet Abraham is very important and significant to Muslims.

Mayada M. said...

To Lord is my Saviour,

You would agree that there are Christians who call themselves loyal or followers but do not in your opinion represent Christians and the Christian faith properly right?

If I were to judge all Christians based on the example of those who are pro Gay Marriage or pro abortion, I'd think all Christian people where ignorant of their own contextual theology. However I know that this is not the case because I do not paint with such a broad brush.
I do believe that people all over the world of multiple monotheistic faiths sometimes fail to educate themselves properly on religious theological matters.

Therefore to make my point, a lot of the world is widely uneducated. If a Muslim somewhere is recorded say for example in Afghanistan for abusing a woman that does not mean that is what Islam teaches.

That is not Islamic. Quite the contrary, Muslim women and men are equated equal to God. And even more so Muslim women have plenty of rights that a man must serve, just as the Muslim man has rights that the woman must serve.

Did you know that a Muslim man is not allowed to take a second wife unless his first wife approves? If she doesn't she is entitled to a divorce. If she does he must meet both their needs equally, meaning he must provide them both separate and equal living quarters. They must be clothed equally. And wealth should be distributed between them equally.

If it is not preformed in a proper manner what is seen to God as a blessing and an act of worship can easily become a sin. A very fine and risky line to walk.

David Wood said...

Mayada,

You say that, in the Qur'an, men and women are equal, and that men are not allowed to abuse their wives. How come I see the exact opposite when I open the Qur'an?

Qur'an 4:34--Men are in charge of women, because Allah hath made the one of them to excel the other, and because they spend of their property (for the support of women). So good women are the obedient, guarding in secret that which Allah hath guarded. As for those from whom ye fear rebellion, admonish them and banish them to beds apart, and scourge them. Then if they obey you, seek not a way against them. Lo! Allah is ever High, Exalted, Great.

Notice that the verse says that "men are in charge of women" because men "excel women," and that men can beat their wives into submission. This is exactly the opposite of what you claimed. So who should we listen to if we want to know what Islam teaches, you or the Qur'an?

Mayada M. said...

To David Wood,

Your doing exactly what extremist Muslims do. Take only one source, the Qur'an and try to interpret God's words. If we were capable of interpreting God's word what use of Prophet's and messengers of God do we have then? Why didn't God just send us a Qur'an and tell us to read that and practice?

Because Islam, and many other Monotheistic religions do not just rely on one source. You have many different sources that are reliable. From chains of interpreted reliable sources, traditions, and those who passed word of mouth and those who recorded religious teachings.

That is why Muslims have Hadith that have been narrated by scholars who've dedicated their whole entire lives just to study one aspect to make it clear for the future generations. And before them it was the times of the Sahaba (Mohamed's apostles) their generation that carried those traditions down. Sunnah is the tradition of the Prophet- pretty much paraphrasing the saying, "What would Jesus do?" And the Qur'an is the mysterious book that has been sent by God.

Did you know that there are some Surah's (chapters) in the Qur'an that no theologian can interpret? That it was a message from God and that is all we know of it. For example. Many Surah's start with just three separate letters. "ALIF (A in English,) LAM (L) & MEEM (M)," do we question it? No, because it is the direct word of God. Do we know what it means or how to interpret it? No.

Thus, for most part of the Muslim world they can't even speak Arabic! They were taught to read the Qur'an at a young age but don't know what any of it means. In fact, the Arabic speaking population of the Islamic world is very small compared to the millions of Muslims that speak native languages of their own country.

But no fear, just because the Qur'an came to man in the Arabic speaking world does not mean it is still not meant for the masses. That is why we have other sources such as the Hadith, Sunnah and Islamic Law (Shariah) to be interpreted in the hundreds of languages across the world because the Qur'an can only be in Arabic.

So, to answer your specific question.
Those versus are interpreted properly in those other sources and by true scholars. Taking it directly from the Qur'an and trying to put it into practice can be a case of improper worship (taking out of context)

And keep in mind that even the Torah and Bible have similar verses. Perhaps you should ask your Biblical scholars what those such vereses mean, what is the origin, has it been removed, or negated by a later verse, or altered etc.
The one advantage the Qur'an has is that it is in its original unaltered form. No add ins, line removals, or re editing. Just straight up and raw. And that is where the other reliable sources come in to explain further how to interpret or "soften, " such verses.

David Wood said...

Mayada,

Once again, you completely contradict the Qur'an. You say that we can't understand the Qur'an without scholars and commentaries to explain what it means. But the Qur’an claims to be clear and perfect as is:

Qur’an 6:114—Shall I seek for a judge other than Allah, when He it is Who has sent down to you the Book fully explained?

Qur’an 11:1—This is a Book, whose verses have been made firm and free from imperfection and then they have been expounded in detail.

Qur’an 12:1—These are verses of the clear Book.

Qur’an 16:89—And We have sent down to thee the Book explaining all things . . .

Qur’an 27:1—These are verses of the Qur'an—a book that makes (things) clear.

Qur’an 41:3—A Book, whereof the verses are explained in detail . . .

Qur’an 57:9—He it is who sends down clear communications upon His servant, that he may bring you forth from utter darkness into light.

So Allah says that the Qur’an is clear, firm, free from imperfection, fully explained, expounded in detail. It explains all things. But then Allah’s Westernized followers come along and tell us that when Allah gives his clear commands, he actually means something totally different from what he says, and that he needs human interpreters to speak more clearly than he can.

Since you've declared that Allah's commands aren't clear enough to understand, you've just told us that Allah has lied to us when he said that his commands are perfectly clear. So Allah, according to you, is a liar.

David Wood said...

But I guess you're right that I do the same thing Muslim extremists do: I let the Qur'an speak for itself, without putting my own spin on things. It's the "moderate" Muslims who twist Allah's words to suit themselves. But according to Muhammad, this is "innovation." Muhammad said that "innovators" are going to hell. Or, do I need a Westernized Muslim "scholar" to tell me what Muhammad really meant?

gran'pa said...

Mayada,
I am on the road now. I am pleased to recive your greeting. When I get home, I will respond to you. I recall you were expecting a little one. They grow up too soon.

gran'pa said...

Mayada,
I am pleased that you included the Torah and the Bible in your source material in your reply to me. I am not contesting that the quran, the hadiths or the sura speak of Abraham, but I am questioning where in Torah, Abraham was instructed by God to build the Kaaba?
Abraham was 86 years old when Ishmael was born 14 years before the birth of Isaac.
From sources that you provide (quran, hadiths, and sura) Kaaba would have been built when Isaac was 3 years old.
Why would a period of years be important? Because Abraham would have been only 103 years old when the Kaaba is alleged to have been built, and would continue to live another 77 years. He would live 20 years beyond the birth of Jacob, his grandson. Shem, a prominent Biblical figure would live 30 years beyond Abraham’s death, and this is an important consideration.

gran'pa said...

Mayada cont:

From Genesis 16 to Genesis 25, nowhere is a commandment given to Abraham to build such a structure as you suggest known as the Kaaba. And had that been so, Shem, a son of Noah would have known of that, if the record of the quran is to be thought true. More about that later.
Ishmael was 89 years old when Abraham died as derived from the Jewish Torah, Subtracting the years of Abraham’s life when Ishmael was born as recorded in Genesis 16:16 from Genesis 25:7 gives us Ishmael’s age. The Kaaba would have had to have been in existence, 72 years by that time.
A question I would ask you is, “In any revelation received by man, which revelation should be considered superior if indeed the revelation comes from God?” Is the older to be judged of the younger, or is the older to be thought the line and the plummet by which every succeeding revelation is to be judged?

gran'pa said...

Mayada, cont:

The foregoing follows after the example given by Moses in the 11th chapter of Deuteronomy, the Israelites were commanded to keep the charge of the Lord your God, His statutes, and His judgements. They were instructed to keep all the commandments “Which I command you this day, that you may be strong...,” and enjoy the prolonging of their days. They were commanded to diligently keep all the commandments, to walk in all the ways of the Lord their God, to cleave to Him. Only then were they to enjoy security. It was at this time that God placed before them the blessing and the curse, warning them, “turn not aside out of the way.”
Consider Isaiah 28:17, “Judgment also will I lay to the line, and righteousness to the plummet: and the hail shall sweep away the refuge of lies, and the waters shall overflow the hiding place.”
It is interesting to me that Jerusalem is mentioned hundreds of times in Torah and even in the New Testament yet the Kaaba remains elusive in Torah as Jerusalem does in quran..
More importantly, the record of the Torah is clear, many of the notable persons of the Torah were contemporaries. Shem, who I mentioned previously, was yet alive when Jacob was born and did not die until Jacob was fully 50 years old. Shem walked the planking of the Ark that bore he and his wife upon the flood along with his father Noah and the other of Noah’s sons and their wives. Isaac was 110 years old when Shem died,
meaning Shem would have known of Kaaba for 107 years. Isaac lived another 70 years longer. Shem had been dead only 41 years when Joseph was born to Jacob, known as Israel.
I know these numbers can become confusing, yet they are true. Shem would have known of Kaaba as would have Jacob, had Abraham indeed been commanded the Kaaba be built. Yet no mention in Torah exists of any command to do Haj, or any mention that Shem performed it, or Jacob or any other of the patriarchs, ever.
This only exists in spurious texts that in no way correspond to any text of “The Book,” or the Gospels (Injil, as known to you), or have any connection with them whatsoever.
The allah of the quran cannot be the God of the Torah or the Christian Bible.
By quran, you must admit that Jehovah cannot have a son, may not be a father, therefore Jehovah cannot be the allah of the quran, yet this is precisely what is said of Messiah in Isaiah 9:6.
And yet never is there mention of Kaaba.

(David, you may edit this for clarity)

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

I erred in the following:
"Why would a period of years be important? Because Abraham would have been only 103 years old when the Kaaba is alleged to have been built, and would continue to live another 77 years.”

The correct number as indicated below should read, “Would continue to live another 72 years.”

I inadvertantly substituted Isaac’s age at death in arriving at what the years of existence of the Kaaba would have to have been when Abraham died had he indeed built it. Abraham was five years younger in age when he died (175) which brings the number in conformance to that in a following passage.

Also, my wife said to me, “Dad, ask her how her baby is?” Women have an interest that men often do not express but I assure you, we each hope your family is doing well and the little one is bringing you as much joy as our children did when they were little ones.

gran'pa said...

David,

What do you know about Nozad?

David Wood said...

Nothing.

gran'pa said...

http://www.born-again-christian.info/nozad.htm

David,
I don’t know if you will find the above interesting or not. I generally avoid things I am unfamiliar with. I had not heard of him either but I do know from experience the harshness directed towards muslims who read the Bible or indicate an interest in it.
You need not publish this post

gran'pa said...

David,

I am nearing 70 years of age. I have not been a Christian all my life and even after first entertaining the influence of God in my life , I behaved foolishly.
In His great kindness, I have not been left comfortless, and in these latter years have grown more than I first imagined possible. God’s grace truly is marvelous.
I have seen both His judgements and His mercy at work. His faithfulness is proven in the works He has performed in my life and I am confident that they shall be complete in their purpose.
As you may have determined, both I and my wife have an affection for Mayada and I can not explain fully the burden we have for her as opposed to others, but that is the way it is.
We used to have a little rabbit years ago, and when it was approached, it would hop away.
Mayada seems to be that way, though no one wishes to harm her.
When I read the account of Nozad, I thought immediately of Mayada. I anticipate Mayada is a wonderful young woman, though think were her husband to know she visited such sites as yours, she would come under his displeasure. If indeed her family is devout, I am sure there would be someone to discourage if not correct her.
This is the only reason I believe she posts only sporadically.
I take pains not to be insulting or demeaning, yet am dismayed that persons such as she cannot come to an understanding that the Bible is true and the quran false. The quran may not be true and the Bible false, for the quran must be judged of the former Word, the Bible, and not the other way around.
The quran is only another match feebly stricken by man to illuminate the Sun which is the Bible, the Word of God.
This is the same Word of God that dispels all darkness.
Mayada has to understand that allah may not have a son according to islam, yet Jesus said at the time the Jews had taken up stones to stone Him, "Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified , and sent into the world , Thou blasphemest ; because I said , I am the Son of God?”
Jews don’t take up stones to stone just anyone, and they assuredly knew that Christ had said He was “The Son of God.”
Even at His crucifixion, those who tormented Him so as He hung on the cross which the muslim denies He hung on said, "He trusted in God; let him deliver him now, if he will have him: for he said , I am the Son of God.”
They clearly understood what it was He said.
In the same passage of scripture in John 10 where Jesus acknowledged the jews had charged Him with blasphemy, Jesus was adjured of them, "Then came the Jews round about him, and said unto him, How long dost thou make us to doubt? If thou be the Christ, tell us plainly.”
They were speaking of His being the Son of God in a way reserved only for Messias.
With the birth of my new Grandson, I have come to a clearer understanding of what our relationship to God is in terms of being “Little children.”
All children are not pleasant, and as any person may tell you parents may not be pleasant also. A brief trip to a supermarket shall well give evidence of that.
Yet, both the child throwing a tantrum and the parent struggling to respond to a childs disobediance and rebellion, are no different in their relationship to God. As the child must come into obediance to the parent, so too must the parent come into obediance to God.
Without a conversion by either parent or child, the anticipation of success becomes diminished indeed.
Also, of the times mentioned by Christ in the Gospels, the child was already humble and came quietly and obediantly to Him for which the child was held out as a marvelous example. Too, the dependency of both children and adults is remarked upon in other narratives, conversion being necessary to conform to the will of God.
In that the Gospels harmonize.
And in all this, we must yet come to Jesus.
I am hoping that at some time, Mayada will come to see that the Isa of the quran cannot be the Jesus of the Gospels and she has indeed gone out into the desert whereof we are warned not to respond to the call of one saying the Savior is there, one of a deceitful work.

Samsung SPC Jaipur said...

To Mayada,
This is about Catholic Nuns' dress. Catholic nuns in India are allowed to wear sari. They do not even cover their head and face (Type "Nuns in Sari" on Google images and see yourself). So, you can say christians can adjust their religion according to place and time which Muslims are not able to do. I was born a catholic in India and have a Christian name but my sister's name is a Hindu name. There are many relatives and christian friends who have Hindu names (Sanjeev, Vinay, Rahul, etc). Hindi speaking North Indian Catholics wish each other :Jai-Yeshu(Jesus) just like Hindus say Jai Shriram etc. All our prayers are in Hindi also our Bible is in Hindi. Muslims never mix with any culture. For thousands of years may peoples came and conquered parts of India and were integrated in Indian culture, except Muslims. They still try to follow 1400 year old Arab culture.
Henry

Samsung SPC Jaipur said...

Mayada,

This is about dress of Catholic Nuns. In India Catholic Nuns are allowed to wear Sari if they want (Type "Nuns in Sari" in Google Images and see for yourself). This dress doesn't cover their head and face and arms. So, you see Christians are able to adjust their religion to time and place. In India Christians have Hindu names, wear Indian dresses (specially ladies) greet each other just like Hindus do, (Namaste, etc.) Of course there is a lot of scope for improvement specially as far as Catholics are concerned. I'm a Catholic and can say that without any fear for a reprimand let alone fear for my life.
Henry

Jo Doe said...

Great website! One of these days I ll click on donate button. We need more websites and people and youtube videos that speak the truth. We are to expose all evil doings and all lies and all perversions of truth. Islam is all that! Muslims do not know much about so called prophet Mohammed(who never uttered a prophecy) nor about his life, most have never read any haddith in their entire life and many do not know Quran either. So speaking about both in public is good for them, so they find out what is hiding behind their religion, what sort of man, what sort of practices. "The truth will set you free". Only talking about the real God, and exposing the false God can people come to the truth, and the truth is Jesus.
David, why dont you make an interview with father Zakariah Butros, that man knows Quran and every other islamic source by heart...in arabic language! He has answer to every islamic lie! And he has courage to speak up much like you folks on here. Or maybe you could at least put a link to videos on youtube with his interviews etc...so when arab people read your website they can find father zakariah too. We should hate lies and love victims of those lies for God loves them too. Jesus came to save us all! "There is no difference between Jew and Gentile, 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. "Glory be to Jesus!

Galen Muhammad said...

This is just another bogus site bashing and trashing Islam and Muslims.

You claim to be a former Muslim, but you must have been a very ignorant one to have those baseless opinions of Prophet Muhammad (saw).

Muslims have a relationship with God/Allah. There's nothing keeping us from His Glory, as you claim!

Unknown said...

I have several versions of the bible most of which I have read. For different reasons I'd like to buy a copy of the koran (second hand probably)but am unsure what version to buy as I dont want one that's had the awkward bits editited out. What version does David Wood use and who is the publisher? Thanks. Julian

David Wood said...

I use several versions, but if you have to pick one, I'd go with Hilali-Khan. (Keep in mind that many translations, including Hilali-Khan, can be accessed free online. Check the "Muslim Sources" sidebar here on the blog.

gran'pa said...

Mayada,

Do you yet visit this web page? I have not been here for some time and was hoping to see you yet posting.
I had neglected some information you gave me regarding a wikipedia site.
I need to point out that of the three times that Abraham was mentioned, your source is corrupted because never does the Bible confirm your remarks, and in all cases it is tradition of Islam which historically is rejected by both Bible and Jewish tradition.
You cannot use a corrupted spring to support your view.

Shama Mukhri said...

Hi Everyone,

I have been reading the Bible for a long time. However, i found some contrasting passages. In one of the videos of Jesus or Muhammad Sam shamoun explicitly said that God assumed a Human form and appeared as Man in the old Testament to prophets like Abraham, Moses and jacob and to some face to face. There are passages in the bible which clearly says that "No one has Seen God" and No one ever saw God Face to face".. Isn't it a Contradiction?? How can i convince myself?

David Wood said...

Not a contradiction at all. When the Bible talks about not seeing God, it's talking about not seeing God's complete nature. God is infinite. How can we see him in all his glory?

But the Bible repeatedly declares (from the beginning), that God can take on a form and walk among us. He did this with Adam, Abraham, etc. Ultimately, God entered creation as Jesus of Nazareth.

i_am_me said...

its been a while since my last visit, 1 year lol ...

@Mayada... thank you for your reply and compliment, i am completely understand your answer regarding my question, since i have watch some movie clips regarding some khalifah, i forgot whom, but unfortunetly i dont seem to see an answer to the valid question, do christian and jews are allowed to worship in mosque? I do not know about the jews, but from my faith point of view christian must pray in every step of their lifes, so lets say that kind of christian somehow stumbled upon a mosque do they allowed to pray inside the mosque (regarding to islam law)?...

i hope one day i can see your answer in this question, i pray for you, husband, and children to be always healthy and in the grace of God.

i_am_me...

Mayada M. said...

That is a very good question @i_am_me, anyone may enter a mosque but their are certain respects that should be followed in the place of worship. For example, no shoes in the prayer area, women must wear modest lose fitting clothing with a scarf to cover her hair. One should be clean upon entering a holy place. That entails clean from sex,clean from the use of the rerestroom. There is a certain cleaning Muslims preform. After showering the preformed wadu' or ablution. It is asystematic way of going about cleaning ones self. Just as pprayer is a systematic way of performing the Muslim eat of paying. Every bodily gesture has a s symbolic meaning, kneeling your whole entire body with forehead to the ground for instance symbolizes your being indebted to God, that you are miniscule and in need of God the almighty. It is a great sign of respect. This is called rukuah in Arabic. So to answer your question. Yes non-Muslims are welcome to the mosque. But it is respectful to come in the above manner and worship in the stated manner. One may also come just to observe and listen at any given time. Some mosques will even provide special translation services if the lecture is not in the National language.

i_am_me said...

thanks for your answer Mayada...

1 last question just to clarify something in my head, since i knew "Wudhu" and "Janabad shower" (my apology if i write this wrong) usually followed by an Islamic pray, so if someone who came is clean (lets just say he got showered at the mosque bathroom) but he doesnt do the Islam rituals during his/her cleaning and afterwards he/she entered the mosque and then pray in the non-Islamic, does this mean he/she is being disrespectful? I am really wondered because at a place where muslim majority rules, usually they tied by being disrespectful to the process is being disrespectful of the whole religion, on which usually leads to a "not good" situation...

wattsizname said...

Have any of you given a review/critique of the 3 part BBC documentary series The Life of Muhammed with Rageh Omaar? If not, I would like to know how unbiased (or biased) and how accurate this series is. It would be great if you could produce some videos on this. Thanks.

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