Wednesday, October 21, 2015

Are There Fables in the Quran? David Wood vs. Shabir Ally

The Qur'an contains numerous stories that are known to be taken from ancient forgeries. The Qur'an even acknowledges that Muhammad's contemporaries repeatedly accused him of copying his stories from earlier sources (see Quran 6:25, 8:31, 16:24, 46:17, 68:15, 83:13, etc.). Do these forgeries call into question the reliability of Muhammad? Here's my discussion on this topic with Shabir Ally in our debate on whether Muhammad gives the truth about Jesus.


David said...

According to Shabir, as the quran given to Mohammed is a copy of the eternal book in heaven, the eternal book in heaven therefore has fables in it and they are meant to bring us into a true knowledge of the One true God. ok (huh?)

Why didn't Allah's earlier revelation (Im thinking specifically of the Injil) contain any of these fables???

Tim Bukowski said...

David, how would you respond to what Shabir said? (that Muhammad had much knowledge of the Biblical text) Do you know anything about the book he cited?

Tim Bukowski said...

David, I think that the book is 'The Bible in Arabic: The Scriptures of the People of the Book in the Language of Islam' by Sidney Griffin

Nojmul Huda said...

@Dr. Shabir Ally,

In your debate on the subject whether Muhammad gives the truth about Jesus, you interpreted John 16 for your support, sending of Muhammad after Jesus, instead of Christian believe Holy Spirit who would help us to understand word of God and to remain holy to receive God’s grace for salvation. I am surprised to weigh your wisdom being a scholar as PhD degree holder in comparing Holy Spirit with Muhammad. Comparative study of Jesus and Muhammad would reveal the truth who could come after Jesus, Muhammad or Holy Spirit to help mankind to be with Holy God during our life time to receive His salvation.

From Quran we find Muhammad a warmonger, killed several innocent people, sex manic, had sex with slave women, with his daughter-in-law, and married multiple women etc. etc. But from the Bible we find Jesus never committed any sin, born out of Holy Spirit, performed miracles etc. etc. and commanded us to remain holy thru prayer and obeying His commandment to receive God’s salvation during Judgment Day. Jesus knows it is impossible for human being to remain holy without help from God and for that purpose He promised to send Holy Spirit to guide us.

How in the world being an educated person like you can believe Muhammad a warrior could help mankind by his corrupted lifestyle to remain holy to receive God’s grace who is Holy, Kind and Merciful??? May Holy Spirit help you to understand word of God!

nacanacazo said...

Listen everybody, I was in a cave in my town and the angel gabriel came with new revelations in rhyme:

Mary had a little lamb, little lamb, little lamb
Mary had a little lamb his fleece was white and snow.


Old McDonald had a farm,
and on his farm he had a cow

Andy Bannister said...

Great article here on the Qur'an and the Alexander the Great legend --- and how the Qur'an clearly believes it to be history:

Tru2isnow said...

I think Shabir ally was hilarious when he mentioned multiple of Sevens to Justify the authenticity of the koran. And he could say it with a straight face. Lol...

TPaul said...

Let us pray that the Holy Spirit whom Shsbir Ally shamelessly equates with corrupted Mohammed, inspires him to see the error of his ways, and draws him to the one true God.
I sincerely hope that Shabir will someday realize how his deceptions to defend Islam are not only hurting himself but also many who hold him in high regard.
Like Farhan Qureshi, I hope and pray that Shabir will renounce Islam.

Andy Bannister said...

On the magical number theories and the Qur'an, which is really the only "argument" Shabir has left these days, see:

Luther-Carlo Suvu said...

at 2:46 to 2:60, Shabbir's answer is apparently ambiguous & unclear when he's sort of 'softly agreeing' with David's argument on Quran being filled with fables. Especially when he said Quran took the lesson from the stories (fairy-tales in this matter to be exact)that people knew already and also Quran doesn't teach people history but more focus on the lesson/value that could be taken from those story.

In this case Shabbir kind of telling us it doesn't matter to study 'the accuracy of those supposedly historical stories in Quran whether those stories were true event or just some CHEAP fairy-tales! and for Shabbir all that's matter is the value/lesson of those story.

It sounds he was depressed and couldn't deny the foolish Fairy-Tale nature of those stories(especially the 300yrs sleeping men).. yet sadly for Shabbir NOT ONE of ISLAMIC AUTHORITATIVE SCHOOLS EVER CONSIDERED THAT THOSE STORIES ARE FABLES

If Shabbir had been speaking in the context of Parables then his argument would've been valid, however the context is those Fairy-Tales are actually believed as historical event by ALL ISLAMIC AUTHORITATIVE SCHOOLS.