Monday, August 19, 2013

Omid Pasbakhsh vs. Naim Khan: Did Jesus Consider Himself To Be God?

Zakir Naik has never faced an experienced Christian debater in his entire career. Why not? Naik knows that his arguments would be destroyed.

In this debate, Naim Khan recycles Zakir Naik's material. Watch how easily Omid Pasbakhsh dismantles his claims.

38 comments:

4justis said...

Wonderful.... Omid had all his facts ready and so clear. The muslim just kept repeating the same tired nonsense that requires Jesus to say the exact words that muslims say he must state.

Radical Moderate said...

Wow who is this guy, he is brilliant. The Christian not the Muslim. Any chance we can get that Power Point presentation.

Did he write that during the debate. To bad there was not a cross X.

It was amazing fast and furious.

The Muslim on the other hand just seemed to ramble and say nonsensical things as usual.

Hazakim1 said...

Two words about Omnid....STRAIGHT FIRE. This was a K.O. after the opening statements. GLORY TO THE TRI-UNE GOD!!!

Philip M Trivett said...

Ok so the Muslim spends 20 minutes quoting the Bible and then says the Bible as we have it is corrupt and can't be trusted! that means his arguments are false too! he does not refute any proof text the Christian puts forward, the. In the end compares Christianity with Hinduism and refutes Hinduism! yet his whole argument has also assumed Unitarianism about The Christian God. the guy must make up his mind as to what Christians actually believe and refute That, not jump from one error to another. He does not deal once with The Christian perspective of God, that we are Trinitarian Monotheists! He should either say he believes Christians are polytheists and believe in Three Gods or that we are Modelists who believe that Jesus , and The Father and The Holy Spirit are three expressions of one person that Jesus is the Father and The Father is The Spirit is The Son and so on and so on.but he does not yet he looks at Christianity through Quran tinted spectacles. the Quran's author did not fully understand what The Trinity was either. And I was surprised that It was the Muslim who uses the word Trinity in the Quran's rebuke of the doctrine. the Word Trinity appears neither in The Bible OR The Quran. So why should a Muslim use it?
he says we have no original manuscripts: we don't for two reasons. Some got worn out and others were destroyed by our enemies. But one day we might find some, God willing. the Quran has no originals either. a Muslim gathered the copies after Mohamomed's death, wrote out his own official version and burned all of the others. not a Christian, Jew or enemy of Islam, but a Muslim! And every muslimMUST believe He got it right on blind faith alone! what if he lied? where is the proof That this official version is correct? How can we know he did not add or take away anything important?

akairey said...

Omid was fast but WELL prepared for the debate and able to refute on the spot with passion! GREAT JOB! He needs to be sent out more often and inlcluded in Woods possee!!

Tom said...

All Glory to Our Saviour Jesus Christ, such an inspirational debate by brother Omid. He never allowed himself to be side tracked from the topic!
Same old tired predictable twisting from this battered muslim, since deedat is not here, we have to settle for the impersonator, surely this muslim experienced "paralysis" as well!

Sancho Panza said...

When Naim copied the Deedat formula 'Where in the Bible does Jesus say "I'm God; worship Me" in those exact words' down to the gestures and voice inflections, Omid should have told him to show where in the Quran it says to 'Pray 5 times a day' in those exact words.

bob said...

Since Islamists do not accept the Christ of the Gospels, they cannot know or understand what Moses, the Psalms and all the prophets are actually saying and teaching.

To Muslims, and to adherents of Judaism and to all others who deny Christ's divinity, even though they may be literate, the Scriptures are sealed to them as if they were illiterate.

They can see the words but do not know their meaning, as prophesied in Isaiah 29: 11-13.

The whole vision has become to you like the words of a book that is sealed, which men deliver to one who is literate, saying, “Read this please.” And he says, “I cannot, for it is sealed.”

Then the book is delivered to one who is illiterate, saying, “Read this please.” And he says, “I am not literate.”

Therefore the Lord said:

“Inasmuch as these people draw near with their mouths and honour Me with their lips, but have removed their hearts far from Me, and their fear towards Me is taught by the commandment of men.”

akairey said...

@Sancho Panza...does it not really say to pray 5 times a day? what about the pilgrimage? or of the walking around the "rock"?

I'm really serious inquiring that. Wood...does the quran not give specific instructions for those 3 items?

Mohamoud Hassan Mohamed said...

it was good debate i appreciate both of them for their efforts for seeking the truth.

both of them agree that Jesus was Messiah, and he was born by marry, and he circumcised, and walked among the people and he was a sign from God and he slept and ate food.

so the Muslims and Christians agree all about the humanity of Jesus, and that is good start.

what we need is like these debates and their continuations in the future, until the Jesus him self come back and join one of us.

bob said...

"both of them agree that Jesus was Messiah, and he was born by marry, and he circumcised, and walked among the people and he was a sign from God and he slept and ate food.

so the Muslims and Christians agree all about the humanity of Jesus, and that is good start."


But they don't both agree that Jesus was God in the flesh.

The Muslim says he was just a creation, but the Scriptures say that he is God.

Felix Tam said...

If Naim Khan wants to go down the path of historical criticism of the New Testament, he should also know that there are many scholars who are the same to the Quran. If one were to study early Christianity and early Quran, then the picture is a lot uglier for Islam than for Christianity. At least he admits that the letters of Paul exists and I would say that there are many other sources - Christian and non Christian - that confirms the existence of Jesus, that he died on the cross and that after his death churches were formed. With Islam, I can't trust anything on the Hadith, the Sunna or the Sira literature because they only started to emerge about 150 years after the death of Muhammad. what's worse is that they have them in such pointed details! If that doesn't raise eyebrows, then I submit that you don't have any common sense. The more detailed the hadith, the longer the chain of isnad, the more problematic it is...

christian varney said...

This is great

Joanna Maria said...

I just pray to God the Father, in Lord Jesus name that all Muslims watch and understand this video explanation about, how Satan created Islam and uses Muslims to destroy Christianity.

1/4 How Satan Deploys Islam:

http://blip.tv/brainout/1-4-how-satan-deploys-islam-773864

Mohamoud Hassan Mohamed said...

@Sancho Panza.

the Bible gives this advice in the
1 Thessalonians 5:21
"Prove all things;
hold fast that which is good"

that means don't take all things for granted but prove all things.

if Muslim debater requested to show him any where in the bible where Jesus saying " I am God or worship me", I think that is not challenge but he wanted to fulfill the above advice which is in the bible " prove all things" and that is christian responsibility to prove and answer to us.

David Wood said...

Mohamoud, can you show me where Jesus says, in either the Bible or the Qur'an, "I'm only a prophet, don't worship me," IN THOSE EXACT WORDS? If you can't, then your beliefs about Jesus must be false, right?

Philip M Trivett said...

The Quran asks Christians to judge the Quran by what came before, it is for Muslims to prove to us (
From scripture, not sword point I should add) not the other way round that Mohammed came in the name of the same God as the Christians and Jews follow. Judging by the Torah and The Gospel, Mohammed was one of two things: the prophet of a New Religion, or a false prophet! Like what Moses and Jesus warned us of!

wilson blaise said...

Praise the Lord for my christian brother, I hope that the God of love uses these brilliants guys such as Omid, Wood, Sam ,Rogers, pastor Jo and others in ABN to bring muslims out of darkness

wilson blaise said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
bob said...

Mohamoud,

"...but he wanted to fulfill the above advice which is in the bible 'prove all things' and that is christian responsibility to prove and answer to us."

How about,

"I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End," says the Lord, "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty." Revelation 1:8

Who else but God can call Himself the "Almighty"?

Mohamoud Hassan Mohamed said...

David,

yes i can show you from both Books
first from the Koran see Chapter 5 Verse 116 and 117

116: "And behold! Allah will say "O Jesus the son of Mary! Didst thou say unto men, `worship me and my mother as gods in derogation of Allah"? He will say: "Glory to Thee! never could I say what I had no right (to say). Had I said such a thing, Thou wouldst indeed have known it. Thou knowest what is in my heart, though I know not what is in Thine. For Thou knowest in full all that is hidden.
117: Never said I to them aught except what Thou didst command me to say: to wit, `Worship Allah, my Lord, and your Lord'; and I was a witness over them whilst I dwelt amongst them; when Thou didst take me upThou wast the Watcher over them and Thou art a Witness to all things"

and in the Bible please see
Luke 6:12
" and it was in the evening and Jesus went to the Mountains to PRAY and WORSHIP GOD"

my Question is why he worship God if Jesus him self is GOD.
which God is he worshiping and he is God !!!! ?????

thanks David

David Wood said...

I asked you where Jesus said, "I am only a prophet, don't worship me," IN THOSE EXACT WORDS. But you have given me other words. Are you admitting that you can't show me where Jesus said these exact words?

Tom said...

@ Mohamoud Hassan:
If someone come to you and tells you:
1) "I am god"!
What is your reaction?
2) And if you are in God's presence, does He need to tell you,"worship me"?


Yes test your prophet, find out from your koran, "Why was there a need for a "virgin birth"?

Joanna Maria said...

@ Mohamoud

1. Muslims claim, that the many different translations of the English Bible will render a single text with many different words and phrases. You said this was proof the Bible is corrupted and that the Koran reads exactly the same way everywhere in the world in Arabic. My question is: Since the many English translations of the Koran also render a single text with many different words, does that proof that the Koran is corrupted?

2. Informed Christians know there is no passage and the Koran that says the Bible is lost altered or corrupted. My question is would you please list all the passages you know where the Qur'an says the Bible that was in the hands of the Christians at the time of Muhammad had been corrupted?

3. Muslims reject the gospel story of Jesus being a substitute for our sins, the just for the unjust. They use the illustration of a man having to pay for a speeding ticket he did not commit. My question is: How do you explain that in the Muslim view of the cross, someone completely innocent died in Jesus place, after God made him appear to be Jesus? Was not this a Substitutionary sacrifice?


... and here more Q's muslims are not able to answer

http://www.bible.ca/islam/islam-questions.htm

Foolster41 said...

Perhaps Mohammad can explain how if our bible is from scripts from around the 2nd century, long before Mohammad was born, how it was "corrupted" to be different than what Mohammad had today. No Muslim seems to want to explain this, even though they claim that scripture is corrupted. I've asked many many times.

bob said...

Mohamoud, you said,

"and in the Bible please see
Luke 6:12"

Then you falsely quoted Luke 6:12 as follows.

"and it was in the evening and Jesus went to the Mountains to PRAY and WORSHIP GOD"

But Luke 6:12 actually says,

“Now it came to pass in those days that He [Jesus] went to pray, and continued all night in prayer to God.”

It says He was praying, not worshiping.

Then you say,

“my Question is why he worship God if Jesus him self is GOD.
which God is he worshiping and he is God !!!! ?????”

Again, Luke 6:12 says that Jesus was praying. Praying is a means of PETITION or REQUEST. It was not an act of worship.

Jesus, who is the second Person of the triune God (God the Son), is praying (requesting/petitioning) to God the Father. So even though Jesus is God, He still calls the Father and the Holy Spirit ‘God’ because there is nothing higher.

All Three Persons are God, as shown by the following.

The word ‘Trinity’ is simply an abbreviation for Father, Son, and Holy Spirit; like a team of three like-minded individuals working together in perfect harmony for the same end. In this case, and since they are of the same nature and essence (which is love and light, and are therefore as ‘one’ and have a ‘oneness’) and have a common purpose and a shared authority, the team as a whole is called God, as per Genesis 1:26, 27...

And God said, “Let US make man in OUR image according to OUR likeness...” So God created man in his own image; in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.

...and Genesis 3:22

Then the Lord God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of US, to know good and evil.”

The verses in the Gospels that are commonly used by some (Mathew 24:36 and the Temptation of Christ etc.) to claim that Jesus was not God in the flesh actually refer to his temporary earthly servitude (Philippians 2:6-11) in the service of the Father and mankind...

“Yet I am among you as the one who serves.” Luke 22:27

...(Including the example set by him for us to follow), for the purpose of rescuing us from sin and Satan’s hold over us.

Jesus, the Creator (Hebrews 1:10; psalm 102:25; John 1:1-14), humbled himself and became like a man in order to become an unblemished and perfect sacrifice on our behalf, as foretold all throughout the Old Testament. He was both the Sacrifice and the High Priest who offered it up. He willingly sacrificed his perfect human nature (but leaving his divine nature intact) in order to make atonement for the world’s sins/crimes.

Jimmy Plant said...

The muslim man was totally destroyed! Hope more muslims watch this..

Hardik Modi said...

Any person who reads the Bible will see so clearly that Jesus Christ is God. One can see that Jesus is God in the Bible as clearly as they see the clouds in the sky above. I just do not understand why Muslims behave like this. Always posing a silly and dishonest argument: "Where did Jesus Himself say, 'I am God. Worship Me?'" They know very well that the Bible clearly teaches that Christ is God Almighty--the great I AM. According to me, Shabir Ally is the most intelligent Muslim apologist in the world today, but I've never seen him using this Deedat-Naik old trick. He knows this question is flawed.

40BelowTrooper said...

Mohamoud, you are simply assuming Unitarianism without proving it. It is absolutely not a problem for the Son to communicate (pray) with the Father, and it is not a problem for the Son to worship the Father either.

If you expect us to believe the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob; the Living God revealed from Genesis to Revelation; is Unitarian you are going to have to prove it not just assume it!

40BelowTrooper said...

This was an extremely one sided debate! Brother Pasbakhsh dominated his Muslim opponent on every level.

Hardik Modi said...

Because of the wonderful works of Sam Shamoun, David Wood, James White, John Gilchrist, and many others, I am absolutely convinced beyond a shadow of a doubt that Islam is a false religion and Muhammad is a false prophet and the Quran looks absurd especially when it tries to attack the deity of Christ, the Trinity, and so on. And because the Quran is filled with nonsense, it forces Muslims also to be nonsense. One of the differences between Christian apologists and Muslim apologists is that Christians speak the truth so accurately and clearly. They never take the verses out of context even from the Quran. But there's not a single Muslim apologist I've seen who has read the Bible or the New Testament as a whole who has used their arguments honestly and consistently. I salute you all for your excellent works. May God use you mightily to bring Muslims out of darkness and into the glorious light of Christ.

Christian Apologist said...

As usual these Muslim Apologist stick with their Deedat Crap and make a fool of themselves. Why do they think is that all is required is a Deedat survival kit?

Derek Adams said...

Omid has obviously studied alot of Sam Shamoun, and hit Naim like a Hurricane without warning. Omid is even able to compact more content into sections of the debate than Sam, because he speaks so fast.

Naim was off topic, overwhelmed, and it was perhaps unfair to say that Zakir Naik would be as stumped as Naim was, since Zakir Naik is a talented orator and skillful taqiyaist. Unfortunately even at the top of his game, Zakir Naik could not go toe to toe with Sam Shamoun. Bassam would be the best contender, but even then Bassam could still not win against an informed opponent.

Philip M Trivett said...

Now I would certainly like Zakir Naik debate James White. That would be interesting!

David Wood said...

James has challenged him . . . repeatedly. We all have. Naik is smart enough to know that his arguments would be destroyed by any experienced Christian debater, which is why he only debates non-debaters.

domcroy said...

I've only listened to Omid's opening statement so far and it's clear that he knows how to explain doctrine to Muslim listeners.
One thing that I think was off though was that he said that Jesus' divinity was 'beneath' his humanity. I don't see how that is at all accurate.
Whenever I explain Hypostatic Union it is that Jesus' natures are simultaneous, true, full, perfect, without one limiting or diluting the other.
Would anyone disagree with me?

tenkaren said...

Hi Domcroy!

This is Omid.
What I meant by: Jesus divinity was 'beneath' his humanity, is that Jesus had a complete human experience and therefore didn’t live out His divinity (unless the Father wanted Him to do so). He voluntarily humbled Himself so that He could represent us as humans in redemption. Of course His human nature didn’t limit Him against His will, but since He choose to live as a human He didn’t act on His divinity, hence He was divine underneath His humanity (makes sense?).

Think about it this way…
One major objection Muslims (and others) have against Christ deity is that He was tempted, while God cannot be tempted (James 1:13).
What the Muslims don’t realize is that this is in fact an argument for Jesus deity!
Because what Satan wanted, by asking Jesus to turn stones into bread, was that Jesus would access His divine powers independently of the Father and thereby not living out His humanity.
So, in order for the temptation to even make sense, Jesus has to be God (i.e. He has to have to ability to do whatever He wants to do)!
But Jesus is a God, that for our sake choose to live as a human, and therefore He resisted the devils temptation by not accessing His divinity – i.e. He choose to be a human and keep His divinity beneath that nature.

I hope you understand what I mean.
God bless!

Ken said...

The Muslim also mistranslated Surah 5:72 into English, and he gave the wrong reference (he said it was Surah 5:32 - at least that is what it sounded like to me)

He translated it as "They are disbelievers who say Jesus is God"

Actually, it says, "they are disbelievers who say Allah is Jesus, son of Mary."

Big difference, since Christians don't even say that.

Another mis-understanding of Muhammad?