Wednesday, June 20, 2012

Sydney Debate - July 7

Organised by IREA in coordination with ASWJ, IDCA, UMA, MYPEACE, Rooty Hill Masjid, UWA-MSA Bankstown.

Topic: 'The BIBLE or The QURAN - Which is God's Word?'

Date: Sat 7th Jul 2012
Venue: The Bellevue, 2-10 Restwell St, Bankstown, NSW.

Entry: $10 Ticket available online (http://www.ireaworld.org/)
Time: 6pm
Islamic Speaker: Br.Imran (Student of Islam)
Christian Speaker: Rev.Samuel Green (Evangelist & Islamic Specialist)

Contact me if you would like to meet up before the debate. Feel free to email any advice. samuelgreen@gotalk.net.au

107 comments:

Zack_Tiang said...

Will this be recorded and the video uploaded online?

I look forward to watching your debate... although I shudder at the thought of how your opponent will present himself. Not a familiar face.. Pray that he is respectful and not prone to fallacious arguments.

Naren said...

Dear Bro.Samuel,

PRAISE JESUS

I just saw the notice on Answeringmuslims about your upcoming debate with Imran on the topic: “The BIBLE or The QURAN - Which is God's Word?”

I am connected with Sakshi Apologetics Network based in India and our brother Jerry Thomas has already debated with Imran on the topic: “Divinity of Jesus Christ and Messengerhood of Muhammad”

This guy Imran-an Indian, is weird with a different style of debating devoid of any logic or common sense… since you are not used to the Indian way of debating, I suggest you to kindly go thru this debate to see how this guy thinks and behaves… You will find a lot of rhetoric, but that’s what works down here… will definitely help you to be prepared for what you can definitely expect from Imran.

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL0C57956251372A0E&feature=plcp

God Bless


Naren

Skýwæłker»» said...

Topic: 'The BIBLE or The QURAN - Which is God's Word?'

What if both are not GOD's word ! how can people can justify the existence of GOD with few written pages of books!

Aristotle , Socrates,etc are very fine philosophers born in West,,they have mastered ethical analytic thinking about GOD, there are 24 Philosophic ethics available to prove the existence of GOD for Humans.
It has been more than 2000 years, another Aristotle or Socrates like people to born in west. still waiting .......

Kraven Amica said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Kraven Amica said...

Hey Rev. Green, I've watched some of the debates of this guy with Bro. Jerry Thomas and others. Please make sure that you work on the Statistics of Population because Imran says that Women are more in Population compared to Men and that since the Koran says Men can marry 4 wives so it is the perfect word of God. Obviously it makes no sense to think that way because Men are more in number than women. He will also speak about Homosexuals, etc.

Infact, Imran is also a Taqiyyist.He will always run from your argument. It will be like your debating Dr. Zakir Naik.

Praying for you that you expose this Taqiyyist! God Bless!!!

Michael said...

God bless Brother Samuel!

Jose Joseph said...

I think that Samuel Green should take the angle that Sam Shamoun took against Shabir Ally, because honestly it is the most effective way especially debating the topic whether or not the Bible is the Word of God. The presuppositional apologetics method is the only way I can see Samuel Green winning this debate. Questioning the World View of the Muslim and demonstrating if the Muslim is going to be consistent with their World View they must accept the Bible as the word of God.

Jose Joseph said...

Another thing I want to add is that Imran will being using the shotgun approach and will attempt to have Samuel on the defensive by overloading him with 101 objections, examples such as so called contradictions in the Bible, textual corruption,scientific inaccuracies in the Bible, so called porno graphic text and much more.

I suggest that Samuel (presses) Imran on the issue that the Quran affirms the authenticity of the Bible. And continue to push that issue through out the debate

I stress this point because when Sam Shamoun debated Shabir Ally on this very topic, Shabir evaded the issue, because he was overwhelmed by the cumulative case Sam presented regarding the Quran affirming the authenticity of the Bible. And because of that Shabir began his shotgun approach on the Bible.

Grant Kelly said...

Samuel Green, watch his opening presentation here (at 13:50)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZtBXjWnYr0&list=PL0C57956251372A0E&index=2&feature=plpp_video

Honestly this is another showman like Ahmed Deedat, I strongly advice you to consult Sam Shamoun before debating this guy, as it's people like this that need to be exposed the most.

Naren said...

Dear Bro.Green,

Having seen you in action, you don't need any "academic" preparation to debate this moron.
What you need to be prepared is for a "CULTURE SHOCK".

This guy is a disciple of the infamous Zakir Naik and an INDIAN. Being an Indian, I can guarantee you that you have little or no idea as to the level this guys can stoop to and will indulge in plain rhetoric and theatrics.

In all the love and affection for you, I can say that you are a very polite guy which will be shown by this unethical guy as a weakness... Please try and bring some "Sam Shamoun" factor in to push back this bully.

Had sent you the link of the debate with our brother Jerry Thomas... please please do see it and prepare accordingly.

May the wisdom of our God rest on you.

In Christ


Naren

la theos said...

I am an atheist.. yet I watch a lotta these inter-faith debates.. and this Imran guy is a major moron with his zakir naik wannabe style...samuel, I think you're too polite a person to debate this moron... you'll be amazed to the level they'd stoop down in order to get some "applause"... be prepared.. good luck :)

OneGod OneBible said...

Go a head My Brother....you have a great weapon two edged sword "Bible" The Word of God.

Samuel Green said...

I just want to say thank you for all your comments. I am reading all of them and watching all the links you send.

Please pray for me too!

ചിന്തകന്‍ said...

Rev green
please visit the following url
http://www.sakshitimes.net/blog/2012/06/15/is-quran-the-word-of-god/
http://www.sakshitimes.net/blog/2012/06/15/is-bible-the-word-of-god/
this are the links of detailed 4 day panel debate on the same topic by san.I will pray for the upcoming debate
Bro jacob

Naren said...

Dear Bro.Samuel,

You can rest assured that Imran will come up with the same antics of his mentors Zakir Naik and Ahmed Deedat which include:
1. Intimidating you in the sense of mocking and ridiculing.
2. Coming up with scrolls which list the so called errors in the Bible
3. Pointing at you, making fun of you at a personal level.

I know another brother whom Imran had debated... he was an American and it was a closed debate. Imran had mocked him so much that this elderly gentleman was reduced to tears... He had never felt so personally humiliated in his life.

Please please be prepared for all such and more. For these people, winning at any cost is all that counts and the Muslims in the audience will be cheering him on and jeering at you.

I am not trying to scare you, please be prepared mentally and perhaps you can take some pointers from Sam Shamoun as to how you can possibly in a subtle way give it back to him.

Do not throw your pearls in front of this pig, it will just be trampled upon.

In Christ


Naren

Tom said...

The focus should be on which of the 2 books is of God.The onus is on the muslims as the Bible came before the koran and God cannot be behind the "spirtual curve".
It cannot be evil first followed by good. If that is the case, then the world was evil first then God followed up to introduce Good, which is re-active instead of being pro-active. God,He is all knowing and the creator of the world, as such must be pro-active!
Their 'yardstick' that the koran is of god is based on the notion that "the verses and langauge is beautiful" & only a "god" could have done so... and I understand that this yardstick can only be found in the koran, Is this methodology indicated in previous scriptures?
The Prophet Isaiah, one of the "A" list prophets is not found in the koran, why? There are many prophesies in the Book of Isaiah, and this god decides to omit him in a later "revelation", why? not a consistent god!
Oh, their argument will be, the prophets are sent for that time only..so why do they record other prophets in their book, as they would of no relevance during the lastest revelation? U cant say that this is another creation of the christians, because this Prophet is clearly found in the dead sea scroll.
Beside doctrinal differences between the Bible & the koran, there is also very clear detail of events differences, If it is of the same God, why are there event detail differences? Eg. Which son was sacrificed by Abraham, why is it not very clearly indicated in the koran to clarify this very important 'milestone'?
Is it becos this god was "afraid" to be laughed off as the biggest joke, there & then by the jews? If he is god, he could have detailed it why Ismail? But he did nothing!
What about the convenants of the old testament, what does the koran say about them?
We now have a New convenant, That is Grace & this god decide to bring back the old convenant, that is the law, through islam, why? He has a dual personality?

Prasanna said...

Dear Samuel, as some of the comments pointed out you are indeed a polite and a civilized person. That's a definite plus. Please don't stoop down to the level of Imran. He can behave in his stupidity and unethical approach almost like his wannabe prophet.

It would be appropriate if you can first clarify two things before defining 'God's Word'...
a. God (which God you are referring to and which god you are not referring to)
b. Word (what does it mean and what it doesn't mean)

Imran will almost certainly raise the issues such as...
- unacceptable language or incidents in the Bible (in which case please ask him what is acceptable in God's word and what is not and why)
- different versions of the Bible
- discrepancies in the Bible

I am sure you are able to answer his questions and attacks with the help of the Holy Spirit. Please make the goal of this debate to win the hearts of Muslim audience which many Christian apologists seem to miss completely. Unfortunately, brother Sam Shamoun is one of them. His writings against Islamic objections to Christianity are fantastic, but his approach in debates seems to lack grace and humility in winning the hearts of Muslim audience. May the Lord grant you His grace and wisdom by keeping His good hand over you.

Prasanna

Opeth said...

Wait a moment, did you just say you are debating Imran? With all due respect, I don't think you should have taken this step, I mean Imran???? What were you even thinking?? Have you watched his Debate with Jerry Thomas? (Not the edited video by Sakshi, whose leader is now rotting in Jail for corruption) but the authentic video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdVy0TvEWWY

He has debated with 10s of Christian "Scholars"but none could defeat him on intellectual level, you still have time, better back off.

DeathCrush said...

Dear Samuel

This is Nathan and I am a Hindu. Though I am not convinced with your or Muslim view about God, because it is incumbent that God comes down in form of Shiva, Vishnu and keeps sending his Avatars for helping mankind. I must admit, as a neutral spectator of the debates of Imran, you should be aware that he is intellectually at a very high level, you may provide him logic but he will provide you a super logic, I hate his religion but must admit he is amazing with his debating skills.

One more point I noticed on this blog, in the comments by Naren, he is a liar, Imran does not stoop down to lower levels unless someone instigates or tries the same.

All in all, good luck if you really think you can debate with this tank.

jonh doe said...

Hey Samuel this man IMARAN is very dangerous.Jerry was shook by IMARAN'S.
I think you should not Debate with this man. He gives lots of counter arguments

Arif said...

Dear Bro.Samuel,
PRAISE JESUS
this man IMARAN is very dangerous.Jerry was shook by IMARAN'S.
I think you should not Debate with this man. He gives lots of counter arguments

raj kumar said...

Neither do I believe in bible or the quran .... but yet I really feel sorry for samuel green.. cause he is debatin with a person who is bound to win with his wisdom & logics.. I did watch imran debating .. he has excellent debatin skills.. Samuel is debating to loose...

Micheal Hussey said...

May God Help you....These are the only words which i could say when it comes with IMRAN..I watched many of his videos i don't know why our christian brothers fail to shut him up,when it comes to logic forget about it he is definetly going to overcome you on logics so be very carefull and moreover they come up with high moral."WHICH INDEED IS MOST DANGEROUS WEAPON FOR US"
Micheal Hussey.

Micheal Hussey said...

Samuel Green be prepare because this man is something horrible he may make you into samuel Red...Just try to foucus him on your subject and moreoever the worst thing about them(Deedat,Dr.Naik and Imran) is they come up with high moral support i don't where it comes from and they use it as ther strong weapon..May God bless you and let the truth prevails over falsehood.
Good Luck.

AVng Micheal Hussey.

adnan sheik said...

Debating with imran.. hahahaha samuel have u ever seen him debatin...if u would have..then u would not have debated.

stephen ev said...

BR.SAMUEL GREEN,I think you should not debate with imran .imran is born to debate. He is unlike other muslim debaters. He may really wash you away in the debate. WHICH WIL BE A PROBLEM TO OUR CHRISTIAN COMMUNITY LATER. And I dont think that we do have as many proofs as the quran has to prove it as word of God.

muhammed sohail said...

How many times will Christians debate with Muslims and loose. but stil do not agree with Truth. This debate wil be clear cut win to Br. Imran. Br.Samuel get ready to condemn yourself,you have taken the worst step of your life. this wil be ur last debate.

Aftab khan said...

i know that at the ens of this debate islam wins and SAMUEL GREEN will accept islam
ALLAH HU AKBAR......

peter sen said...

Helo, my dear brother samuel green, you should really work hard to win the debate. I watched debates of imran , with different pastors and evangalists, including the debate with jerry thomas of sakshi. I was there at the debate of imran with jerry, imran uses many logics to disprove the bible which really seem to be true to a common man. I , as brother in faith would not have recomended you to have debate specially with imran. GOOD LUCK.

sarasvati reddy said...

Br. Samuel green i was a spectator in the debate of Imran and i suggest you to better prepare very strongly for your debate with him because he has a superior logic and reasoning beyond your thinking...

Waseem Uddin said...

Brother Imran is blessed wid a good knowledge n i think he can prove dt "DER IS NONE WORTHY OF WORSHIP BT ALLAH" n "THE QURAN IS THE BOOK OF GOD"

Saba said...

Mr. Samuel green if the entire community of Christianity come together to support ur religion Christianity, your entire community cant even debate with the student of the student of the student of sheik Ahmed deedat , Dr. Zakir naik, Br. Imran and Br.waseem.

jessie mathews said...

Dear Bro. Samuel,

This fellow Imran is having a very different style of debating, i have seen his videos on you-tube it is very difficult for any one to debate this fellow please watch the following links given below to know more about his debating style.

I pray Lord for your victory.

regards jessie

zeeshan said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
anil kumar said...

HI MR GREEN,
i saw this person.....many times...even i witnessed him...debating with one of my brother jerry thomas.please try hard because he is a man with great wisdom..i too got daze after witnessing...so please work hard..and try your best..jesus is with you...

zeeshan said...

I can say with 100% confidence that SAMUEL GREEN is no match to BR IMRAN...BR IMRAN is eloquent and dynamic speaker...

DesiLeaks said...

I think Samuel will loose outright as there is no comparison between Quran and Bible. One is pure word of God and other consist very minor part of word of God.

NIzamuddin said...

Hi
Samuel being a muslim i am telling u that be prepare for debate to face br imran.Br imran is a dangerous man in the feild of dawah... u look like a small child in the front of br imran.
inshallah 100% sure br imran win this debate....

Tom said...

I am shocked David that you allowed this sudden surge of negative propaganda to "rattle" Brother Green just before the debate.
Regardless, The Holy Spirit guide and Bless Brother Green during the debate.

  said...

Alhamdulillah, love Jesus for how he is supposed to be loved, as Islam rightly Allah says.

We asked you NOT to debate with Br Imran and NOW you know we meant it, he is not kid and he is not a University student, he had the power of Islam and the Truth with him. I sincerely (as undiplomatic as I could get) pray that you take this as a lesson and ponder Islam with rationale view and seriously consider it, inshaAllah.

Saba said...

hahahaha do you now understand the power of Quran and Islam? Sadly you will never be able to debate pubicly now

Saba said...

as i said earlier you can't even debate the student of the student of the student of shaik Ahmed deedath, Dr. zakir naik , Br. Imran and Br. Waseem. And you know the result now.

muhammed sohail said...

one more looser samuel green,joining the list of loosing debates with muslims. CAUSE TRUTH ALWAYS PREVAILS,and QURAN is the true word of ALLAH[THE GOD].

mechozome said...

Br Imran wins the debate... samuel not fit to debate Imran ,he shld first debate students of his students... then win them and debate Imran. And by default u cant reach Imran.lolz..

Muhammad Abdul Qawi said...

when will the Christian world accept the truth that Quran is the only 100% verbatim word of Allah.
mr. samuel i think this was your last debate of your entire life, and im sure you would not dare to debate any muslim after this. I pray Allah that he guides you to right path and give you the guidance of Islam. Insha Allah

David Wood said...

Tom said: "I am shocked David that you allowed this sudden surge of negative propaganda to "rattle" Brother Green just before the debate."

I seriously doubt that Samuel was "rattled" by a group of two or three Muslims who post a ton of comments under various names in order to intimidate opponents. If anything, this only shows that they DON'T have confidence in their debater. Why else would they have to post comments, sometimes pretending to be Christians and Hindus, bragging about some debater that I've never even heard of, and saying that he's a follower of Deedat and Naik (which, if these commenters knew anything, would be an insult)?

Naren said...

Dear Bro.David,

You run a wonderful blog. I guess this is a new strategy by Muslims to spam your blog with nonsense rhetorical junk.

I always make it a point to read even the comments and not just the main article on your blog since there are good contributions by many such as Anthony Rogers, Radical Moderate, the ocassional Sam, etc... please do not let these Taqiyya oriented religion followers spoil this good thing you have got going.

In Christ


Naren

ahmed wakeel said...

Dear Samuel Green,That was your best efforts but we appreciate you more if you put some more effort to understand the word of god clearly........Winning and loosing is part of life but as a muslim i would suggest you to become muslim and there is a saying of our beloved prophet that "Those who are the worst in jahaliya(arrogance time) can be the best if they become muslim"....Common man how many proves you need to understand that Quran is a word of god and until the day of judgement no one can change it.

Zack_Tiang said...

I agree with David.. It was obvious that (despite the numerous accounts) it was done by the same 1-3 persons (and yes, obviously pretending to be Christians or hindus or whatever).

Plain pathetic, really.
I'd personally be insulted if someone(s) did that for me.

DesiLeaks said...

I was there at the debate. I can assure you that Samuel became a laughing stock at the debate when his questions were answered. Best defence is offence and Br Imran was too clever and on offence throughout the debate.
Christian evangelist are no match to Muslims as all of their questions are either their misconception or been convincingly answered. It doesn't take more than a minute to think if Jesus is the creator, sustainer and cherisher of this whole universe and everything in it including you and me. Of course the answer is NO, so what are you waiting for? Submit to the only creator who created you and me

anil kumar said...

i too witnessed...the debate..and i already warned MR.SAMUEL to work hard..but at last my advice to my friend is "do not give up because ur closer than u think..." work hard for the next tym...hope to see u back again.....jesus is with u always....

anil kumar said...

"keep this is mind neither SUCCESS nor FAILURE is ever final.." so better luck next time....and work hard jesus is with you always......

Kazim Salini said...

I am a christian,i do agree,that Imran has good skills in insulting others and making people clap for silly points and superficial claims.But as a student of phiilosophy(epistimology + methodology) i can assure that Imran is devoid of any logic.For an educative person who is not trapped by jokes and focuses on the argument Imran is a total failure.I remember brother jerry winning the debate with him.

Kazim Salini said...

As a student of philosophy (epistimology + methodology)i think Imran is devoid of any logic,hardly come to the atgument and performs a fallacy of straw man all the time.
He is though a good speaker who knows all the tricks and insults his opponent.
Whilehe can impress the uneducated with his claims but the educated ones hardly admire him.Also he debated and lost to Jerry Thomas on educated arguments.Soone defeatalready,lets see how samuel performes

Kazim Salini said...

Imran is a kind of man who know nothing about logic and yet makes a rheotric of logic.Just ask him to name only 15 logical fallacies and hewill not be able to provide.

Tom said...

Hi Brother David,
Thank you for showing me, that it is the hand of satan .... resorting to cowardice & lies to instill fear... the typical devil's hand.
All Glory to Jesus our God & Saviour.

Abdul Rahman said...

I have been following the blog and the debate.
I have a request to all non-Muslims here.... whether supporting Mr. Green or not- this debate cleared the misconceptions about Islam(religion of peace) in reference to Bible(also).
How about choosing the best and only religion acceptable (on the judgement day) in the sight of the Creator of the universe.
An Info for the non-Muslims: the Creator of the universe, Heavens and the Hell is the Most Merciful and Inshaallah will accept repentance and guide to the right path and that path will save you from the Hell Fire and take you to Heaven(where you shall live forever-Inshaallah).
Please read the only 100% word of God- The Holy Quran, not as a religious book but as a guide for the complete mankind and make sure to keep a clean and open mind while reading, so it will be easy to understand.
For any kind of support, doubts, etc., please feel free to contact IREF- India (http://www.irefworld.org/) IREA-Australia (http://www.ireaworld.org/)

Eddie said...

Thank you Br Sam, that was an excellent debate... I love how your style was Calm, but still exposed Br Imrans lying tongue... Never have I heard so many lies from a single man in a debate about both the quoran & the bible

I love how he was refuted even in his concluding statement (about the issue of 116 Suras) as this truth exposed his foolish lies. In a room of almost 95% Muslims I especially love how nobody clapped for his conclusion, but they clapped for yours.... This just shows who won the debate. God bless brother...

Aazib said...

@Kazim:Your condition of providing 15 logical fallacies is itself so illogical because your desire is not a criteria to understand logic and Br.Imran is not a professor of logics but he is only a servant of Allah in the service of Islam and this designation and job cannot be understood by a Tom,Dick and Harry, neither by a Kazim,Kazib and Aazib,but can be understood only by those who are elites of logic. Therefore Mr Kazim, a mere servant of Allah who says I believe in Allah to be The Only One God and Muhammad[s] as the Last & Final Prophet & Messenger of Allah, is more scientific, more rational & more logical than all great logical people according to your standard. The outcome of the debate is an evidence how illogical you are and how Br.Imran's logic hit Samuel Green,you and all people like you to scream as you are doing now.

Kazim Salini said...

Eddie:Why are you calling him brother.He is a blasphemer.Some time ago Bro.Jerry Thomas decreased his popularity dramatically and defeated him.Now he was looking to regain his lost glory by debating green.Eddie with your above comment i now respect australian muslims if they thought like that.

Eddie said...

Just a few examples of foolish quotes from Imran from that debate:
. "Br Sam told us a lot about what the quoran says about the bible but notice how he doesn't say what the bible says about the quoran - the bible doesn't even mention the quoran" (shocked audience)
. "the bible was not translated into Latin until St Jerome in the 7th century" (St Jerome lived & died in the 400s)
. "The bible never says Jesus is the Son of God... The quoran tells us to believe in the gospel of Jesus, not Matthew, Mark, Luke or John. If the Christian can show me a gospel of Jesus in their bible I will get baptized tomorrow" (in Q&A a man asked him to quote the first verse of the Gospel of Mark 1:1 - this refuted all his points)
. He attacked Br Green and said he doesn't know any Arabic (which he does), then claimed Christians mistranslated parts of the bible when he doesn't know Greek, Hebrew or Latin (very funny how much this humiliated him when he was asked if he knew these languages in Q&A)
. He claimed changes in words of the bible in newer editions, but his examples dont exist
. He lied about a clear interpretation of a verse in the quoran to which he was corrected by a woman in Q&A
. He made many claims about the bible & the Quoran which were simply lies backed up by no evidence
. He denied a quoran existing with 116 Suras, which Br Green unofficially exposed his lies through showing the host (Imran stood refuted in his own conclusion) leading him to change his concluding statements

In conclusion Imran is full of blind passion & argumentum ad hominem (attacks on the speaker rather then the argument). He also didn't answer any questions raised in Q&A but substituted it with an answer to his own question... I felt emarressed for Br Imran's performance in that debate & I await watching the debate on youtube. This was just the impression I got from the talk

Tom said...

Recently, I have been going through some of the debates on youtube, & I realised that christian debaters are overwhelemed we the lies and distortions during the debates... that they miss the opportunities to do "slam dunks".
The minute they are writing down one lie.. the next second another one turns up.... everytime a muslim debater opens his mouth its a distortion... We should look for that "slam dunk" distortion & grinding it in!
Eg Sabir Ali, once used the incident, with the women who had the issue of blood to refute Jesus's deity, by saying, if He was God, "How come He did not know who touched Him?" Too me that was "slam dunk" opportunity, but unfortunately it was not capitalised.

Sunnah Quran said...

what a funny name, answering Muslims, why u think we muslims need any answer from u or answerable to u, we have all answers in Quran and Sunnah and we are answerable to Almighty God not you or Jesus(pbuh), as a matter a fact Jesus (pbuh) himself will b answerable to God Almighty and will deny that whatever you Christians are doing now, he never taught it. So Christians, come to common terms and the common terms are worshipping one and only one GOD but not Jesus(pbuh) who was created by GOD just like Adam(pbuh). May GOD open your heart as HE has open the hearts of thousands of christians around the world and they have reverted to Islam. Muslims should be giving the message to Christians and then we should leave it to GOD whether HE has chosen guidance for them to take them to paradise or HE has blocked their hearts and have chosen hell fire them. Its in GOD's hand not in any muslim's hands

Naren said...

Dear Bro.Green Bro.David,

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE upload the video... I am checking your site a few times daily for the same... I never felt so eager to watch any debate. Please do the needful as soon as possible.

@Kazim... you observed right, Imran is just full of blind passion spouting blind rhetoric... personal insults (the Indian flavor to debating) and theatrics. The greatest miracle of the Quran is the gullible Muslim audience who devoid of the least shred of common sense clap mindlessly at senseless talks of the likes of Deedat, Naik and now.. Imran.

@Azib, @Abdul Rehman, etc... I just feel sorry for you for your logical fallacy of "Personal credulity"... in other words, you feel if a lie is told again and again (with no evidence)... it will be taken as the truth... repeating the same junk 5 times a day further adds to your problem.

In my earlier posts I had predicted that Imran among other stunts will make personal attacks on Bro.Samuel and also display scrolls which has lists of the errors in the Bible (theatrical stunts of Deedat, Naik, etc)... he did precisely the same... (guess I am a better prophet than Mohammed :))

Instead of trolling and spoiling Bro.David's blog... please go and prostrate yourself before your new idol... Imran

In Christ


Naren

Kazim Salini said...

@ aazib

you said:Your condition of providing 15 logical fallacies is itself so illogical because your desire is not a criteria to understand logic

Response:That i said because muslims above was flooding the text and saying Imran is super-logical.Now how silly an idea of superlogic is.
Furthermore how can one speak with logic when one dont even know the rudiments of logic.Imran don't know logic and fallacies that's why he makes propositions such as that.
Imran in his debate with jerry:
"More than his jesus jerry was talking about me,no problem he will still gets his ajar(reward) for it,since imran was the name of the grand father of hazrat essa,so no problem i am his nanajaan(grandfather)

Aazib please explain the superlogic of above.

Kazim Salini said...

Aazab said:Br.Imran is not a professor of logics but he is only a servant of Allah in the service of Islam and this designation and job cannot be understood by a Tom,Dick and Harry, neither by a Kazim,Kazib and Aazib,but can be understood only by those who are elites of logic

me:haha,guys laugh with me together.As per the above comments only a few people can understand such a complex(according to aazab).
Aazab,let me educate you brother anyone even little read in pure logic and syllogism can understand the logic.

Prasanna said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Kazim Salini said...

David(philosophy post gradute) tell aazab which fallacy is here in the stance.Since he dont conside me in elites.lol

"I was watching jerry for 50 minutes speaking and shouting as if trying to prove something which cannot be proven,he must have taken his entire motivation from a cartoon show named the tom and jerry show"

David i can see atleast two logical fallacies here,but please tell this aazab(may God guide him),that is that above is superlogical.

Kazim Salini said...

The outcome of the debate is an evidence how illogical you are and how Br.Imran's logic hit Samuel Green,you and all people like you to scream as you are doing now.

me:Sir i am hearing the opposite,that Imran was quite pathetic.That we will tell after the video.Jerry Thomas has already defeated him ,now just waiting for sir green,if whether he did the same.

Kazim Salini said...

Just checked aazab's facebook account and blogger account,a fresh account made to propogate this imran propaganda.Already exposed on facebook,now let's see here.

Kazim Salini said...

Final Prophet & Messenger of Allah, is more scientific, more rational & more logical than all great logical people according to your standard

Me:Sir please explain this hadis

Kazim Salini said...

Volume 7, Book 65, Number 356:

Narrated Sad:

Allah’s Apostle said, “He who eats seven ‘Ajwa dates every morning, will not be affected by poison or magic on the day he eats them.”

Arputha raj said...

Please upload the debate videos. eager to watch one more defeat of Bro.Imran.

Arputha raj said...

please upload the debate videos in youtube. I heard, Bro. Imran was defeated by Rev.Samuel Green. Bro.Imran its a shame for you to continue your irea works. Bro.Imran accept Jesus Christ as you saviour and friend. No one Like Him.

John Smith said...

Thanks Eddie for all those foolish quotes by Br Imran, I was also at the debate and was shocked at the constant deception Imran told to Muslims and non-muslims alike with the intention to make them doubt the truth of the gospel… If someone needs to lie to defend their faith, then it definitely can not be the true faith – thank you Imran for proving how incorrect Islam is…

Here are a few more first hand quotes from the debate from what I remember:

1) “The bible has 101 contradictions outlined in this book, and when I look up the Jehovas Witnesses they say there are over 50,000 errors in the bible” -> mind you, Jehovas Witnesses are not Christians and they have edited the true Christian bible

2) “I believe 90% of what Mr Green has said is wrong, and only proves the Quoran is the word of God” -> He didn’t even back up this claim by answering any of the points although the man who sang the opening prayer to the debate yelled “Takbir” to which the crowd responded “Allah we akbar” – I guess this response of the crowd was enough evidence for Imran

3) Imran promised Sam Green a paid trip to India for a public debate if he could find a single Quoran in his home land of India with 116 Suras and he assured everyone by the power of Allah that Sam Green will not find it -> Imran, I guess you owe Sam a paid trip to India since even the host confirmed the evidence Sam presented

4) Imran promised he will be baptized the next day if any Christian could find a gospel of Jesus in the bible – An audience member asked him to quote Mark 1:1 “The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God” -> I guess Imran will be changing his religion shortly & I cant wait to see the photos

5) “Jesus called his mother ‘woman’ in one of the gospels and Christians are so embarrassed by Jesus showing his mother disrespect, that new translations of the bible translate this greek word as ‘mother’” -> well he was talking about the verse John 2:4 and here are all the English translations of this verse if anyone is interested http://bible.cc/john/2-4.htm – as you can see it is an outright lie

defender of truth said...

hi john smith
if you consider other versions of the bible it says mother, like philips modern bible, new english bible
and in living bible mother and woman have been thrown altogether out pls have a look

Kazim Salini said...

Arputha raj:Yes did you watched jerry vs imran.read the transcript if you want to avoid imrans insults and ad-hominem(just one out of many fallacies).Jerry won the debate and pawned imran on many many points.Jerry destroyed imran on the argument of muhammad in the Bible.Actually that argument was sea-saw battle,but at the end jerry defeated proving that following imrans criteria even sri ram is mentioned in the Quran,will he accept it?

Shad saleem said...

Ariputha Raj[quote]please upload the debate videos in youtube. I heard, Bro. Imran was defeated by Rev.Samuel Green. Bro.Imran its a shame for you to continue your irea works. Bro.Imran accept Jesus Christ as you saviour and friend. No one Like Him.[/quote]
It was actually reverse of your comment Br.Imran Defeated Samuel and it will become evident once the video of debate gets uploaded on you tube.and Jesus is not your saviour God is the Saviour

Tom said...

John Smith said:

4) "Imran promised he will be baptized the next day if any Christian could find a gospel of Jesus in the bible – An audience member asked him to quote Mark 1:1 “The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God” -> I guess Imran will be changing his religion shortly & I cant wait to see the photos"

:) Brillant, John... looking forward to the conversion of imran to Christianity.... but alas they practise the principle of taqiyya

Prasanna said...

We are waiting for the unedited debate videos! Looks like Imran is main organizer of this whole debate either he can avoid putting them on youtube or edit them to save his face. By chance, if he chooses to put them unedited and that too at the earliest then the truth that Samuel Green won the debate will become so evident to all. Either way, Imran at loss!

kazim salini said...

@shad saleem:I dont know who is lying here,but green saying that imran didn't touched his major contentions.

Further more on which points you think imran won in the debate.

Arif said...

@kazim wait for Video to be uploaded man. Very soon You all and especially samuel green will regret for having a debate with Br.IMARN and Getting known by bliions of people all over the world

Samuel Green said...

Hello Everyone, sorry for the massive delay. Straight after the debate I had to go and run a week long conference on the sovereignty of God. It has been a very busy 3 week period and I am still finishing things. I have recorded the debate so don't worry it will be available. It will just be a little while. It will post it on Answering Muslims asap.

The debate was a great time and while I was nervous beforehand IREA was very helpful and organised things well. I want to thank all the Muslims who came for their enthusiasm and I want to thank the Christians who came and gave their support.

Naren said...

For all the Muslims... please read Bro.Green's response above. This is what a true Christian is all about. For a taste of Islam... read the blind rhetoric by the blind followers of Zakir, Deedat and Imran above.

Mr.Green is a gentleman of a debater... with the peace of the LORD resting on him, no "I won" nonsense... No pointing fingers and making fun of Imran... Compare it with the content posted by Imran on his site.

Bro.Samuel... you are an inspiration... GOD BLESS.

In Christ


Naren

kazim salini said...

Arif:Yes i will see the video myself to see if imran responded to samuel green(if at all).As regarding you muslims ,i have good reasons not to believe you,since you people claim imrans defeat as victory(haha) and even PJ(TNTJ) horrific defeat somedays ago as victory.Jerry thomas has already defeated imran,now let see samuel(surely) doing that.

kazim salini said...

Hey, readers first of all i want to apologize for the sillyness and desperation of the muslims comments,since they are here for me.

As regarding the debate video,its not a new thing,yes we are awaiting for it and all the more if u people win with such an ease,then whats the point of coming again and again and comment "we won".Since if it really went like that it will be obvious,But the more and more frustated comments shows me some thing.haha

wnet computers said...

I know Jerry Thomas he don't know even Bible if ask anything he have to turn the pages by pages of Bible to answer

wnet computers said...

Even I have watched Debate between Imran and Jerry Thomas but Jerry was not answering for Imran questions and i have seen many debates Muslim scholar and Christian Scholars and Muslim scholars never failed in any debates and same time Christians scholars failed to answer the questions of Audion's and Muslim scholar if anybody can prove im wrong please give me the link of video which is live recorded

kazim salini said...

Let us look at more and more blind passioned comments.

W net computers said:

I know Jerry Thomas he don't know even Bible if ask anything he have to turn the pages by pages of Bible to answer

me:What does this prove,opening the Bible and reading something to validate the answer.If you cant memorize the verses than u cannot answer the question(is that what u trying to say).Horrible.You people are so addict to the show manship of zakir naik and his contemporaies.Horrible.

kazim salini said...

Open challenge to w net:

I think jerry answered most of his questions 5 out of 10.Imran tried 4 out of 21.and jerry won on many points and many arguments went unrefuted.

But leave that all,lets come to very important points.Sir if you saw the debate,tell me where imran responded to the following points(actually he got destroyed on them)

1.Preservation of the quran
2.Muhmmad in the Bible.

There are other points won by sakshi but for thetime bieng show me where imran responded that(if he ever did).

kazim salini said...

As regarding christians winning the debates,sirin west most debates are wonby christian scholars.Go see the greatest islamic scholar ahmad deedat debate with dr josh mcdeowell,and then come to me.haha

Adil said...

Hi

Adil said...

Hi Wnet Computers,

What an intelligent Muslim you are?:-) So according to your reasoning i.e. Islamic reasoning, just to turn pages of the Bible means that Bro. Jerry Thomas did not know the Bible?! If that's how you argue that's no surprise to US. You are only showing to us how insane logic Muslim employ to declare win while miserably failing the debate on a scholarly scale. On the other hand, just by parroting a religious book one cannot claim that he knows that book and its message well! Imran only knows the Quran in a 'parrot-reciting' style! Jerry had to teach him Quran and hadiths while arguing with him. In the end Imran only showed his talent in trying to humiliate his opponent by cheap tricks, quoting the Bible out of context and avoiding the questions Jerry raised. Yes, he won by Islamic logic, but miserably failed by true logic.

Naren said...

Bro. David, Bro. Samuel Green,

Its been more than a month and I check your site atleast twice a day for the debate video... I know you are keeping busy... but please please post the video at the earliest...
When can you possibly be doing it?

In Christ


Naren

eliya raju said...

some said that SAMUEL cannot debate student of student of student....student of imran.

imran and his students(students of student...) run away when they challenge SAMUEL in scholarly manner

eliya raju said...

We CHRISTIANS have already prophesised deedat ending so he disregarded the warning and had his account closed.

Samuel Green said...

I have been told that the DVD of the debate will be available from December 2 at
http://www.ireaworld.org/

Then some time after this it will be on Youtube.

eliya raju said...

I saw the debate and found out how imran presented himself(biased). he at one instance said PROPHET MOSES was there at 3000 B. C. and he didnot remembered that JESUS was away from MOSES time.

if MOSES IS MIRIAM's BROTHER HOW WILL THERE BE A GAP OF 1000 YEARS BETWEEN THE MOSES AND JESUS(MIRIAM/ MARIYAM SON according to the quran).
conclusion: QURA'N IS NOT GOD's WORD DUE TO HISTORICAL ERRORS IN IT.
I know that you debate in a different manner

Zarid Hussain said...

Hey Samuel Green .... grow up man...still u can embrace Islam... don't wait because nobody knows when death come unto him !!

Ayesha said...

To all the Muslims n the forum ,

Before asking someone to convert to your religion, can you tell with 100./. Confidence that those practising Islam are ideal human beings.

I have come across so many Muslims in the UK who are so aggressive,defensive,hate filled and arrogant.They never lose an opportunity to ridicule or mock others and their faith.muslim women especially are so full of hate and aggression.

They defend atrocities on Muslims but never condemn the wrong doings of Muslims.

Is the almighty God so dumb that he created different religions. Why are some born Muslims and others under different religions.Most Muslims are Muslims by virtue of their birth or by forceful conversion in case they loved a Muslim. If the almighty lord Ida's given special privileges and made some to be born as Muslims ,how come they are to ideal human beings.


Zakir naik to imran to rest are making fools of the billions of foolish masses and hoarding wealth and money in the name of daawat. Zakir Naiks body language to mannerisms doesn't show any humility ,modesty or any virtues as God desires.however it shows arrogance.overconfidence ,ego and he mocks many debaters openly.wont be surprised if he has paid them to come and debate and lose in public in front of the jobless crowd who come to cheer him and clap when he puts down other religions...

If I have to face hell and hellfire ,I will do so gladly.better to go to hell than to heaven if Muslims will be there..i will even ask God on the day of judgement about whatever I feel .I am sure the almighty Lord must be laughing at everyone.

DEEN said...

This is to Miss Ayesha !! Why do u look at the people to judge a religion.. before u talk about Zakir Naik and Other Muslim religious persons Know them Personally!! Do u know how much Does Zakir Naik Save for himself.. Have u ever been to Brother Imrans Home and see how his place is and How he lives his life.. I Agree that some muslims are aggressive!! But u shouldnt judge a reigion by a person. If u wanna judge Islam by a Religion Judge by taking the name of Mohammaed PBUH.. Masha Allah U have such a beacutiful name.. Did u even know how much hard word Did Ayesha RTA did to Prevail the truth.. Isnt it ur responsibility to spread and speak the truth!!

Samuel Green said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Samuel Green said...

The debate is online.
http://youtu.be/WLySrGMt-4M

I had agreed with the organizers that my PowerPoint slides be included in the video production. They have not done this.

I am also not sure that the recording is complete. When I get some time I will confirm that it is complete and post it on this blog.

Zarid Hussain said...

@ ayesha for yr kind information Islam doesn't believe in conversion like Christianity....when some one embraces Islam we call it "Revert" i.e. going back to original. So if Samuel Green embraces Islam in future (may Allah give him hidaya)then he will be considered as a revert i.e. going back to the original religion of all the prophets including Jesus Christ(pbuh).

Sai Krishna said...

You did an excellent job Bro.Samuel Green. Imran used deceptive tactics and ran away from your questions. It's sad to see how people like Imran mislead the innocent muslims and ignorant people. I pray God so that He might open their eyes to the Truth revealed in the Bible. May Jesus be glorified.

Sam and David, May our Lord bless your work.Merry Christmas!

eliyaraju said...

imran was confused by his talk
1) he said Moses was there 3000 years ago
and every one know Jesus was there 2000 years ago
Now my question is how can there be a gap of 1000 yrs between Moses and Jesus if Moses was uncle of Jesus?

eliyaraju said...

2)he produced a comment that HOLY BIBLE was written by men.
now if we can observe that he pose this comment inorder not to get a question from the debator that quran was compiled by the followers of muhammed. he actually hides quran bein corrected by many muslim scholars where as if the Bible it has not been corrected.
for further more details search REV.SAMUEL GREEN`S BLOG.
3)there are many mistakes in the Bible, now if we can clearly observe the debate he concentrates on the translational mistakes as if they are the mistakes of the Bible (not the original Text mistakes).i.e., translational mistakes as the mistakes of the BIBLE. but easily says that quran has no mistakes while he concentrates on the original text and also admits that there are translational mistakes in the quran.
now let the people decide who is on the just.

AS THE BIBLE HAS NOT BEEN ALTERED IN THE MAIN SCRIPTURE BUT HAVE MANY TRANSLATIONS.

quran has many errors in the translations as the muslim scholars hide it . but CHRISTIAN SCHOLARS do not do like that

and let the people decide that whether has been edited or not.