Sunday, January 22, 2012

Thirteen-Year-Old Pakistani Girl's "Honor" Killing Covered Up by Family, Police

I'm sure Muslim groups like CAIR and ISNA would be upset about such "honor" crimes, if only there weren't so much "Islamophobia" to complain about here in America.

PAKISTAN--The body of a teenaged girl who was allegedly killed in the name of honour was exhumed by a medical team on Saturday after the divisional bench of the Peshawar High Court ordered a re-investigation into the case.

The inquiry team, which included two medical officers, was headed by judicial magistrate Rashid Rauf Swati.

Rehnaz Bibi, 13, was allegedly shot dead by one of her cousins in September 2010. According to reports, Bibi left home to convince the boy she liked to marry her without her family’s consent. However, she was sent back home by his family, who lived in the same village, with the promise to send a proposal for her later.

When her family found out about the incident, her father, who was in Karachi at that time, allegedly asked one of his nephews to kill her.

According to an application filed in Haripur district and sessions court by a local activist Qamar Hayat, Rehnaz was fired at with an AK-47 and received 30 bullets. Her family had termed her death as an accident.

The petitioner claims the police closed the case and allegedly concealed facts pertaining to her murder. (Read more.)

31 comments:

Dragostea said...

"Rehnaz was fired at with an AK-47 and received 30 bullets. Her family had termed her death as an accident."

When i said that muhaMAD brainwashed the real muslims, i really meant it: really ? she was shot dead with 30 bullets by mistake?

"Sir, i thought she was the trash bag because you know that when they have that burka on, and especially when they seat down, muslim women really look like trash bags. So, my defense attorney can argue and explain you more that this is a common tradition in my village: if your mommy sends you to take the garbage out and you dont want to, you can shoot the trash bag with an ak-47 that each of us have.

About the ak-47, it's a tribe tradition: have one, even if you dont have bread because you can not honor kill your daughter/cousin or the kuffars with a bread...

This is what our beloved Brophet (SWAT, sorry i meant: the hell SWAT team already got him) told us to do.."

His real muslim brainwashed attorney: "I rest my case..."

Andish said...

The religion of peace! The religion of peace!

So tired of hearing lies from Muslims. We don't want your hate, we don't want your aggression, we don't want your domination over women, we don't want your stoning and hanging Capitol punishments, we don't want your anti democracy views, we don't want your intolerance of other religions, we don't want your ban on alcohol, we don't want your ban on paintings, sculptures, secular television, and we don't want your 12th century views on life.

SGM said...

Day after day, week after week, month after month, year after year we see the violence promoted by Islam. Honor killing (murder of your own family members) is part of Islam just as killing apostates or murdering non Moslems. Murder, as other sins in Islam, is so much sugar coated that it is not looked upon as a heinous crime (sin) by Moslems.

Honor Killing. Just think about it, what honor is there in murdering your own child or any member of your family. In this instance, what was the crime. The girl wanted to marry a guy. How much wisdom does a thirteen year old child has? So she made a mistake to go the family of the guy without her family’s permission. Is this mistake worth a precious life? Well don’t be surprised, in Islam it is. You leave Islam, it is worth a murder. You are a non Moslem, you are worthy of death. It appears, solution to lot of their issues is murder.

My point is that, Islam is such a twisted religion in which a heinous sin like MURDER turns into honor. As a Moslem, you don’t look at it as a crime but something mandatory to comply with. Have you ever heard of honor killings in Christianity, Hinduism, Buddhism or for that matter in any orther “ism”? In Islam, if all honor killings were reported, you will hear hundreds of them every day.

May the Lord protect us from such evil to take hold in our societies here in the West. Unless the people wake up, unless they really understand Islam and the horrific nature of it, it will continue to creep in our societies and before you know it, it will be too late. With this politically correct agenda of the liberals, to accept Islam and Shariah law, it is like neglecting a fester. Eventually, it will take over the body and kill you. Exactly, it will kill you, or murder you, and it will be considered an honor.

janey said...

David - completely off topic but I could not find a general "contact" link. My apologies if I overlooked it. I read that you were an atheist who was studying the Resurrection in an attempt to prove Christians wrong and that research essentially converted you. Is that research available to be viewed either for purchase or for free? I am struggling quite a bit myself with questions of faith and find you to be well spoken and very well researched. Thank you.

Samatar Mohamed said...

@SGM

Before we discuss the treatment of apostates in Islam, you must be consistent in your actions. If you want to condemn a belief that allows apostates to be killed, then don't be biased if a similar teaching occurred in the bible. In Deuteronomy 13, it says that an apostate tries to convince you to leave your belief, that you should put them to death for such a heinous crime. The reference I am giving you is in the Bible, therefore, if you are consistent you will either condemn such a teaching, or you will explain to me what was actually meant by the passages, even though it is pretty self explanatory.

Deutoronomy 13 (6-12)

6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death, because they tried to turn you away from the LORD your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery. 11 Then all Israel will hear and be afraid, and no one among you will do such an evil thing again.

David Wood said...

Hi Janey,

What level are you looking for (intro, intermediate, advanced)?

Christine said...

Hi David, please tell us ur comments about this. http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/jan/22/prejudice-islam-hajj-british-museum?fb=optOut

Hezekiah Ahaz said...

30 accidental bullets?

For some moments in life there are no words- Willy Wonka

simple_truth said...

Samatar Mohamed said...

"@SGM

Before we discuss the treatment of apostates in Islam, you must be consistent in your actions. If you want to condemn a belief that allows apostates to be killed, then don't be biased if a similar teaching occurred in the bible. In Deuteronomy 13, it says that an apostate tries to convince you to leave your belief, that you should put them to death for such a heinous crime. The reference I am giving you is in the Bible, therefore, if you are consistent you will either condemn such a teaching, or you will explain to me what was actually meant by the passages, even though it is pretty self explanatory.

Deutoronomy 13 (6-12)

6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death, because they tried to turn you away from the LORD your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery. 11 Then all Israel will hear and be afraid, and no one among you will do such an evil thing again.
"

In your eagerness to quote Deuteronomy, you failed to see that this is not about killing those who chose to leave but in preventing people from trying to turn the Israelites away from God. Also, keep in mind that this was a directive for Israel only. It didn't apply outside of it's borders. The commandment was designed to keep Israel pure and holy in God's eyes because He set them apart from all other nations. This is not a command to go to other nations and impose this mandate, which is what Mohammad did. This is not associated with any kind of conquest of those who were not already apart of the group. This has nothing to do with the Islamic parallel you are trying to draw. You totally missed the application. I am not surprised at all though.

The first 5 verses of that chapter explain the situation. Perhaps you should have included them too, that is, if you actually tried to understand what was going on in the context.

"Deuteronomy 13

New International Version (NIV)

Deuteronomy 13
Worshiping Other Gods

1 [a]If a prophet, or one who foretells by dreams, appears among you and announces to you a sign or wonder, 2 and if the sign or wonder spoken of takes place, and the prophet says, “Let us follow other gods” (gods you have not known) “and let us worship them,” 3 you must not listen to the words of that prophet or dreamer. The LORD your God is testing you to find out whether you love him with all your heart and with all your soul. 4 It is the LORD your God you must follow, and him you must revere. Keep his commands and obey him; serve him and hold fast to him. 5 That prophet or dreamer must be put to death for inciting rebellion against the LORD your God, who brought you out of Egypt and redeemed you from the land of slavery. That prophet or dreamer tried to turn you from the way the LORD your God commanded you to follow. You must purge the evil from among you."

Andish said...

Samaras you've missed the point of the Old Testament and New Testament completely.

We as Christians don't reject the Old Testament scripture. We just don't follow it because we know the purpose of it. There was a need for the tribes in the Old Testament to follow these rules regarding the death penalty. When Jesus Christ, may I be filled with the Holy Spirit for mentioning his name, came he didn't necessarily abolish the Law, but he changed its purpose.

The best way to explain is when Jeus Christ, may I be filled with the Holy Spirit for mentioning his name, told the Jews to cast the first stone if they are without sin. That's why we don't stone anymore or kill adulterers or kids who disrespect their parents. If you want to talk about consistency then there's some for you. Jesus Christ, may I be filled with the Holy Spirit for mentioning his name, told us not to judge others and condemn them when we could be worse persons or have deeper sins. These punishments were done away with to jive with the new teachings of our Lord and Savior Jeus Christ, may I be filled with the Holy Spirit for mentioning his name, which were to love your enemies and seek peace.

So David isn't being inconsistent. You're just living in the Old Testament ways. You don't need to live like that anymore. If you follow Islam correctly then you must kill and stone a woman who simply got lost in the moment and had sex with a man that she isn't married to. But to be even more critical of Islam all you need to do is FLIRT with another man and you'll be killed. Come to the light in Jesus Christ, may I be filled with the Holy Spirit for mentioning his name. Then you will know how to live.

Andish said...

I used to have sexual relations with lots of women. So many I don't know how many. But then I wanted to find God. And I found him through Jesus Christ, may I be filled with the Holy Spirit for mentioning his name. I repented from my sins and now I am married, making 3x minimum wage.

Under Islam I would of never had a chance. I would of been killed. Without mercy. No Muslim can deny that because your scriptures would contradict you.

Under Christianity I had a chance and I found salvation.

That's the problem with Islam. It's backwards and doesn't give repentance a chance. If you kill a child that committed zina, it's acceptable. Under Christianity it's despicable.

Islam doesn't give peace a chance. Christianity says there is no salvation without peace. That peace is brought by Jesus Christ, may I be filled with th Holy Spirit for mentioning his name.

Derek Adams said...

Janey,

Type in youtube "William Lane Craig Ressurection", there are so many full debates on the ressurection.

Also Mike Licona has some good debates, and an indepth book on the subject.

SAMATAR, stop running bro:

http://www.answeringabraham.com/2012/01/quran-929-and-zaatari-and-samatar.html

Derek Adams
www.AnsweringAbraham.com

Hezekiah Ahaz said...

"Jesus Christ, may I be filled with the Holy Spirit for mentioning his name"


This is a classic.


Andish good one.

dstewart said...

I don't understand what honour killings have to do with Islam itself rather than how some Muslims express it. Doesn't it say in Sahih Bukhari "Not to kill your children?" (Volume 1, Book 2, Number 18). By the way, I am a Christian in case there's any confusion. I just want to know if we're being consistent in examining Islam itself rather than just certain actions done in the name of Islam. Thanks.

John 8:24 said...

Hi everyone,

I have been away for a while...just a little too busy. I just read this amazing news of a Kuwaiti prince becoming a Christian and the first thing that came to my mind is post it Answering Muslims blog!

http://tinyurl.com/6svofue

According to the report, the Kuwaiti prince,Abdullah Al-Sabah,released an auido file and declared, "First of all, I fully agree with the distribution of this audio file and I now declare that if they kill me because of it, then I will appear before Jesus Christ and be with him for all eternity"!!!

Search 4 Truth said...

@ Andish

You make a great point that you would have been killed before you had the chance to find Christ.

I have said this before concerning people like Malcolm X. He would have most likely been killed as well before he had a chance to find the lie of Islam. Or at least he would have had no limbs. He was a criminal and found the cult of Islam in Prison. He would never have had that chance under Islamic rule.


Peace in Christ

cornholio said...

@Samatar Mohamed,

Gee when was the last time anyone Jewish killed anyone else for renouncing Judaism? Gee when was the last time a muslime apostate was threatened or murdered for renouncing islam? Nice try at equivocation, but then again your religion is all about equivocation isn't it?

Kelly the New Wunderbar said...

This is reminiscent of the Shafia Mass Honour Killing wrapping up here in Canada. (Daughter wanted to marry outside of Daddy's realm and get the ****away...)

SGM said...

@ Samatar,

simple_truth and Andish has shed light on Deut 13. I agree with simple_truth and to drive the point little further I would say this. First, what does apostasy means. It means to leave one's religion. No where in Deut 13 does it states that kill apostates. There is a huge difference with killing some one who simply leave his/her religion as in Islam then killing some one who is enticing believers to worship other gods. In Islam, if one leaves Islam, he is to be killed, period. In Duet 13, no where does it state that if some one leaves the religion, kill him. The whole chapter talks about the punishment of one who is trying to astray Israelites to worship other gods.

Samatar, I appreciate you bringing this point up. But in order to understand the Bible, you need to consider the whole counsel of God which is found in the whole (entire) Bible and not just in Deut 13. In the ten commandments, Exodus 20, specifically the second commandment we read that God is a jealous God. He does not like that his chosen people leave him for other man made gods. Therefore, He gives specific instruction to His people to get rid of them who would lead people astray from the true and living god.

By the whole counsel of God what I mean is that, as we read that God is a jealous God, we also read that God is a merciful and loving God. In time, He shows His love and mercy thru His son Jesus Christ. When Jesus arrives on the scene, there are some changes made. For example, we now don’t follow ceremonial law. Similarly, we don’t stone people as Israelites were told in Duet 13. This is where you need to understand why there are two testaments in the Bible, the new and the old. Under the new testament, we go by the what Christ wants us to do now under the new testament and not the old. The old testament was very specific to Israelites. The old testament served its purpose in revealing God as a Holy, just and a jealous God. With the new testament, God also reveals Himself thru Jesus Christ as a loving and merciful God. So now, we have the full revelation of God and we live by full revelation not just what is found in the Old testament. In some case, the new testament has made the old commandments even stricter. For example, the old command was not to commit adultery, now if we even look lustfully at a women, we have committed adultery in our heart.

So comparing killing apostates in Islam has nothing to do with Deut 13. May the Lord open your eyes and bring you to His fold.

simple_truth said...

Samatar Mohamed said...

"
Before we discuss the treatment of apostates in Islam, you must be consistent in your actions. If you want to condemn a belief that allows apostates to be killed, then don't be biased if a similar teaching occurred in the bible. In Deuteronomy 13, it says that an apostate tries to convince you to leave your belief, that you should put them to death for such a heinous crime. The reference I am giving you is in the Bible, therefore, if you are consistent you will either condemn such a teaching, or you will explain to me what was actually meant by the passages, even though it is pretty self explanatory.
"
I thought that I would make one more comment, Samatar.

As you continue to try to point the finger back at Christians, you only continue to show that you are admitting that the poster who responded to you or made a point is correct about your religion regarding the topic at hand. You don't really gain anything by trying to use a tu quoque fallacy approach. It only makes you loose credibility in the eyes of others. Believe me when I say that your rating is already very shaky.

It should have been obvious to you that the context of Deu 13 is not about apostasy in context of the Qu'ran where Muslims can denounce Islam on conscience and thought without any enticements and are threatened by death if they don't recant their apostasy; rather, it is about enticing believers to worship other gods which could lead to apostasy. It is the opposite of what you are trying to prove. This passage actually works against you because it would instruct Jews and Christians to kill Mohammad for enticing Christians and Jews from serving God since Mohammad is trying to lead them to serve Allah, a false god in the eyes of Jews and Christians. I know that you think that the god of Israel is the same god you serve; but, that is irrelevant to the Bible's position; so, you can't superimpose that view to us.

David Wood said...

dstewart,

"Honor" killings are perfectly consistent with Islam. The Islamic command not to kill one's children refers to not killing them simply because you don't want them. It has nothing to do with killing a daughter who rebels against Islam (thereby placing her in the "apostate" category).

Samatar Mohamed said...

@Simple truth

"In your eagerness to quote Deuteronomy, you failed to see that this is not about killing those who chose to leave but in preventing people from trying to turn the Israelites away from God."

No actually, if you read my post, i said it was about apostates who try to convince you to leave the faith. Here is what I said exactly. " In Deuteronomy 13, it says that an apostate tries to convince you to leave your belief, that you should put them to death for such a heinous crime." So as you can see, I did make the distinction, hence why I said it was a similar concept not the same.

" Also, keep in mind that this was a directive for Israel only. It didn't apply outside of it's borders. The commandment was designed to keep Israel pure and holy in God's eyes because He set them apart from all other nations."

But that still poses this question? Do you agree with the fact that God allowed the killing of certain individuals because they tried to convince others to join a new faith. Does that deserve stoning at any point in time. Is the conquest and killing of innocent people acceptable at any time? If you say yes, than please tell me why? And if you say no, than you have condemned your Bible. Therefore, I encourage you to actually read my posts before you make the wrong judgement about them.

Andish said...

Also Tu Quoque on samatar..

Samatar Mohamed said...

@SGM

It seems I have confused the Christians on my part because I have not clearly laid out what I meant. Let me get right into the meat and bones of the topic and why I paralleled Deuteronomy with the hadith. Now apostasy in islam is punishable by death only if the apostate declares this openly. But why is that the case, simply because of the effect it would have on the other people in society. They would begin to doubt Islam and might leave islam leading them to an eternity of hell. As Bassam Zawadi mentions

" Now let us come to the apostate. A person who would openly declare his apostasy affects the people around him. The people around him might ask themselves "Why on earth did this Muslim leave Islam? Is he out of his mind? Or maybe he discovered something wrong with Islam? Maybe Islam isn't that clear after all!" These people would then start to doubt their religion. If they seriously doubt their religion, they cease to be Muslims. If they cease to be Muslims that would very likely land them up in the blazing fire of Hell for eternity.

In the previous example, we saw that the murderer was executed because he caused his victim so much physical pain even though it was only for a matter of a few minutes, however with the apostate we see that he could cause the people around him so much spiritual damage by destroying their souls that these people could land up in the blazing fire of Hell for eternity.

With all honesty, which crime is worse? Stabbing a person for a few minutes or making him burn for eternity? The answer is obvious and we know that it is the latter. If the latter crime is much worse, why are we insisting that it is difficult to grasp why Islam would call for the killing of apostates then?"

Continued

Samatar Mohamed said...

continued

Now, to parallel this with Deuteronomy, you see that when someone tries to convince the believers to leave their faith, the punishment was for the persuaders to be punished to death. Hence, if you can understand the message in Deuteronomy, you can also understamd that message in Islam. Now remember, only apostates who declare their apostasy openly are to spoken to in attempt to bring them back to the faith, but if they insist, then they will be executed. Also remember, that this is under sharia, not in the United States, or another country where sharia is not mandated. I also want to point out that I recently took this position. Before, I was under the belief that no apostate should be killed, but that would entail innovation in Islam, and by the grace of Allah (swt), i changed my position with regard to what the authentic narrations say.

Andish said...

You heard it everybody... Muslims kill non-Muslims to save their own people from the fires of Hell.

Unbelievable.

"With all honesty, which crime is worse? Stabbing a person for a few minutes or making him burn for eternity?"

Please take a course in Logical Fallacies 101. Maybe even take a beginner course with LF 100.

Samatar Mohamed said...

@Andish

"You heard it everybody... Muslims kill non-Muslims to save their own people from the fires of Hell.

Unbelievable."

What is so unbelievable about it Andish if you can explain to me in detail. What do you find is morally wrong with the punishment of an apostate who leaves Islam in an Islamic nation and declares it openly to put a shadow of doubt into the minds of muslims. If you can explain to me what is morally wrong with it?

rest of his post("With all honesty, which crime is worse? Stabbing a person for a few minutes or making him burn for eternity?")

"Please take a course in Logical Fallacies 101. Maybe even take a beginner course with LF 100."

LOL Andish those were not my words but the words of Bassam Zawadi. If you want to throw insults at someone for those words throw it at him. His email is bzawadi@gmail.com. Just a warning though, I am pretty sure he is smarter than someone who needs to take a beginners course in LF 100.

cornholio said...

"What is so unbelievable about it Andish if you can explain to me in detail. What do you find is morally wrong with the punishment of an apostate who leaves Islam in an Islamic nation and declares it openly to put a shadow of doubt into the minds of muslims. If you can explain to me what is morally wrong with it?"

Unreal. Go back to whatever 8th century islamofascist pigsty spawned you. The modern, 21st century world doesn't really need you or your religion of intolerance, hatred and antisemitism.

cornholio said...

Closer to home, in Tampa, Florida to be exact, a CSI has alleged that the Tampastan PD has been complicit in a coverup of an honor killing there in 2011. Pamela Geller's website Atlasshrugs has all the details on how the Tampastan police dept. came to the conclusion the woman beat herself to death.

janey said...

Hi David - Sorry for the delay in getting back to you. My mother was hospitalized. Intermediate level would be great.Thank you!

David Wood said...

There are two major styles of Christian apologetics, the evidential approach and the presuppositionalist approach. Both approaches are important.

William Lane Craig's "Reasonable Faith" is an excellent example of the evidential approach.

The lectures and debates of Greg Bahnsen are excellent examples of the presuppositionalist approach.

I've been planning to make some videos about Christian evidences for a while, but haven't gotten around to it yet. Maybe in the next few months.