Tuesday, March 8, 2011

Isaiah 9:6: Holding A Muslim Dawagandist's Feet of Snow to the Fire

In a very poorly researched article, a certain Muslim dawandist had no compunction about making the following, easily falsifiable claims in the context of discussing Isaiah 9:6, all of which, accordingly, will be dealt with in short order:

1) the passage is about Hezekiah (not the Messiah)

2) the Jewish “Targums” refute the evangelical view of Isaiah 9:6

3) the “Targums” assign the first three titles of Isaiah 9:6 to God and the last one to the child (i.e. Hezekiah)

4) the Angel of the LORD is not God, i.e. a divine theophany

5) “neo-trinitarians” “impose” their views on the Old Testament

Since the dawagandist in question obviously spent very little time and effort researching and writing the post in question, and since he managed to make so many errors in such a short space, all of which can be put down with a few swift but devastating strokes, the following will not aim to be comprehensive. Indeed, the article is so badly done, were it not for the fact that this individual makes covert reference to me and brother Sam Shamoun, I would not even bother with a refutation.

First of all, it would be interesting to know what the author is referring to when he speaks of “Targums” in the plural on the book of Isaiah. To my knowledge, there is only one extant Targum on Isaiah, the Targum of Jonathan Ben Uzziel.

Second, it is evident that this individual did not read Targum Isaiah, for it not only interprets the passage Messianically, but it assigns the entirety of the passage's lofty descriptions and titles to the Messiah.
The prophet said to the house of David, For unto us a Child is born, unto us a Son is given, and He has taken the law upon Himself to keep it. His name is called from eternity, Wonderful, the Mighty God, who liveth to eternity, the Messiah, whose peace shall be great upon us in His days.
Third, the Septuagint (LXX), a pre-Christian Jewish translation, because of the ascription of divine titles to the Son and child of the prophecy, such as “wonderful”, which is only otherwise used for God (and the Angel of the LORD) in the Old Testament, understands the prophecy to refer to “the Angel of Great Counsel”.
For a child is born to us, and a son is given to us, whose government is upon his shoulder: and his name is called the Messenger (Gr. angelos) of great counsel: for I will bring peace upon the princes, and health to him. His government shall be great, and of his peace there is no end: it shall be upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to establish it, and to support it with judgment and righteousness, from henceforth and forever. The seal of the Lord of hosts shall perform this.
The above shows, contrary to this dawagandist's claims, so-called “neo-trinitarians” like me and Sam are not “imposing” our views on the Old Testament; rather, it is those who, as a judicial consequence for the hardness of their hearts, are missing the obvious. As it says in the Targum of Isaiah 6:
In the year in which King Uzziah was smitten with the leprosy the prophet said, I saw the glory of the Lord sitting upon His throne, high, and lifted up unto the highest heavens, and the temple was filled with the brightness of His glory. Holy ministers on high stood before Him: each one had six wings; with twain he covered his face, that it should not see; and with twain he covered his body, that it should not be seen; and with twain he was ministering. And one cried unto another, and they were saying, Holy in the highest and exalted heavens is the house of His Shekinah, holy upon the earth is the work of His might, holy forever, world without end, is the Lord of hosts, the whole earth is full of the brightness of His glory. And the posts of the threshold of the temple moved at the voice of Him that cried, and the house of the sanctuary was filled with cloudy darkness. Then said I, Woe is me, for I have sinned, for I am a guilty man to reprove, and I dwell in the midst of a people polluted with sin: for my eyes have seen the glory of the Shekinah of the King of the worlds, the Lord of hosts. Then flew one of the ministers unto me, and in his mouth was a word, which he received from the Shekinah of Him who sat upon the throne of glory in the highest heavens, above the altar. And he placed it in my mouth, and said, Behold, I have put the words of my prophecies in thy mouth, and thy iniquities are put away, and thy sins are expiated. And I heard the voice of the Word of the Lord, which said, whom shall I send to prophecy? and who will go to teach? Then said I, Here am I, send me. And He said, Go, and tell this people, who are diligently hearing, but understand not, and see diligently, but know not. Make the heart of this people fat, and make their ears heavy, and darken their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and repent, and it shall be forgiven them. (Targum Isaiah)
And, as the apostle John, the apostle of “the Word” (see John 1:1-18), declared, these things were spoken about Jesus, who came unto His own, but was not received, just as Isaiah prophesied:
"Now My soul has become troubled; and what shall I say, 'Father, save Me from this hour'? But for this purpose I came to this hour. Father, glorify Your name." Then a voice came out of heaven: "I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again." So the crowd of people who stood by and heard it were saying that it had thundered; others were saying, "An angel has spoken to Him." Jesus answered and said, "This voice has not come for My sake, but for your sakes. Now judgment is upon this world; now the ruler of this world will be cast out. "And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all men to Myself." But He was saying this to indicate the kind of death by which He was to die. The crowd then answered Him, "We have heard out of the Law that the Christ is to remain forever; and how can You say, 'The Son of Man must be lifted up'? Who is this Son of Man?" So Jesus said to them, "For a little while longer the Light is among you Walk while you have the Light, so that darkness will not overtake you; he who walks in the darkness does not know where he goes. While you have the Light, believe in the Light, so that you may become sons of Light " These things Jesus spoke, and He went away and hid Himself from them. But though He had performed so many signs before them, yet they were not believing in Him. This was to fulfill the word of Isaiah the prophet which he spoke: "LORD, WHO HAS BELIEVED OUR REPORT? AND TO WHOM HAS THE ARM OF THE LORD BEEN REVEALED? [Isaiah 53]" For this reason they could not believe, for Isaiah said again, "HE HAS BLINDED THEIR EYES AND HE HARDENED THEIR HEART, SO THAT THEY WOULD NOT SEE WITH THEIR EYES AND PERCEIVE WITH THEIR HEART, AND BE CONVERTED AND I HEAL THEM. [Isaiah 6]” These things Isaiah said because he saw His glory, and he spoke of Him. Nevertheless many even of the rulers believed in Him, but because of the Pharisees they were not confessing Him, for fear that they would be put out of the synagogue; for they loved the approval of men rather than the approval of God. (John 12:27-42)


Zack_Tiang said...

Good job, Anthony. =)

Anthony Rogers said...

Praise the Lord, Zack.

By the way, I find it more than a little humorous to watch Muslims bounce off of each other like an old episode of Keystone Cops.

Whereas this dawagandist appeals to post-Christian Jewish anti-missionaries who argue that the prophecy is about Hezekiah, contrary to the great majority of ancient Jewish interpreters who understood it to be about the Messiah, one of his co-religionists, Osama Abdullah, actually argues that the verse is a prophecy about Muhammad.

Anthony Rogers said...

By the way, I have corrected several typos, one of which Sam brought to my attention. Sorry for that.

Zack_Tiang said...

What? Osama did?
Wow... the hidden attempt to 'deify' Muhammad seems to grow more and more blatant..

I recall on PYEM's blogpost, one of his commenters said, "...my prophet the prophet of Islam on whom may me , my mother and my father be sacrificed.."
Wow... to be sacrificed to or on Muhammad...
I was surprised no one made mention of what he said... unless there's some doctrine regarding sacrificing to/on Muhammad that I'm not aware of.

Quote, said by Nisa_usa_007, can be found here...

Radical Moderate said...

Wow snap crackle pop. Amazing article, I find it interesting that Snowman frosty feet appeals to ZIONIST ANTI MISSIONARY RABBINICAL JEWS WHO DON'T BELIEVE THAT JESUS IS THE MESSIAH, to prove that Jesus is NOT THE MESSIAH IN ISAIAH 9:6. But wait Jesus is the MESSIAH in Islamic Theology so I guess then that Islam is wrong?

Nothing unites Zionist Jews and Jihadi's like a common hate of Christ.

minoria said...

I have the answer to why it can not be about Hezekiah,it is due to chronological,historical reasons,even geographical:


Radical Moderate said...

Frosty the Snowman
was a jolly happy soul
With a Quran Cob Pipe
and Pinocchio nose
and two eyes made out of coal.

Frosty the Snowman
Is Jinn Fighter they say
He is made of Bull
But he's Just a fool
when he chases Jinn away.

There must of been some magic
In that Jewish Website he found
For when he placed it on his site
He began to dance around.

Frosty the Snowman
Was as cold as he could be
And the Muslims Say
He can dance and play
Just the same as you and me.

Frosty the Snowman
knew the Truth was hot that day
So he said "LETS RUN"
Becasue it's no longer fun
As he began to melt away.

Down to the Masjid
With a bomb clenched in his hand
Running here and there before his prayers
Saying "Catch Me if you can"

Frosty the Snowman
Had to hurry on his way.
But he waved goodbye
Saying don't you cry
I will be back again some day.

Thumpety thump thump

Thumpety thump thump

Look at Frosty go

Thumpety thump thump

Thumpety thump thump

Over the hills of snow

proof for god said...

well so much for some muslims using early Jewish sources! powerful and fasinating article. a real keeper. im glad now rarely comes where i live.

proof for god said...

edit "snow" in place of "now."
(im glad snow rarely comes where i live).