I just don't get it. They live in New York, I live in New York. They claim that Islam is true, I claim that Jesus is Lord. They like to argue, I like to argue. It would seem, wouldn't it, that some public debates would already be in the works? Not at all. I contacted them, but they didn't respond. And they're even posting our videos now!
Amazingly, while many liberal Muslims can't stand these guys because of their views, I actually respect them for proclaiming what Islam really teaches. I hope that they will eventually gain enough confidence to defend their views in public debate.
As things stand, they only seem willing to debate their fellow Muslims.
I think Sam and I will challenge them publicly next time on "Jesus or Muhammad."
*****UPDATE***** Well, I finally heard back from our friends at "Revolution Muslim." Yes, they refuse to debate, and they gave the classic "You-reject-Islam-so-there's-no-point-in-debating-you" excuse. Then the leader called me a "nigger" and threw many other insults at me (not to mention my mother!), in an email worthy of Nadir Ahmed's website. As it turns out, I was totally wrong about these guys. Based on the video I had seen, I assumed that they were intelligent young Muslims eager for dialogue and debate. After receiving a single email, I see that they are spoiled children eager for attention, but not knowledgeable enough to discuss their beliefs rationally. They have no business sharing the podium with anyone.
I don’t think Imam Shamsi Ali will accept the debate challenge, because his sources are decisive: Islamic teachings are against him and for the views of Revolution Muslim. It is as simple as that.
But I noticed that they call that Sadiq guy a “sheikh”. What makes one a “sheikh” any way?
A "sheikh" is a Muslim scholar, and Sadiq definitely isn't a scholar by any stretch of the imagination. He has no clue what's in the Muslim sources.
There are a couple of debates available of this alleged sheikh.
If i was a muslim i wouldn't propogate this person.He did terrible in the debates i have seen.
asfar RM is concerned, I believe but just debating these guys is like winning the debate. They pretty much agree with evrything being said on this blog.
And to amplify Dr. Wood's definition, Nak, a Muslim "scholar" undergoes rigorous testing. If he can get his sandals on the proper cloven hooves, he qualifies as "scholar" according to Islam's Ummah. Of course, we know the true "scholars" of Islam are called "apostates".
These guys are proof positive that the theory of evolution is just wrong.
David i'm just curious what topic would you debate them on.
is Islam a true religion? i knw its not and y dont these muslims understand it? havent they heard of other muslim people testamonies about Jesus coming to them in there dreams? Islam is so harsh towards other people of faith and there own people. i just hope they come to the true faith of Jesus before the rapture. Islam is going no where and JESUS is coming back to rule this world.
I liked what Rafael said. Many of the things you would say about Islam, they would simply agree with. Like the radical sheikh who was expelled from England and said that the movie Fitna "could have been made by the brothers".
But I think there may be something more than that.
I can imagine quite a few Muslims would look at these debates and say, "Why on earth should I give a public platform to these lying hypocrites who want to call Mohammed a false prophet and make him out to be a primitive idiot?"
What surprises me is that you find Muslims to debate you not that these guys won't. My old college roommate Bob Spencer can't get any Muslims to debate him.
It's possible that "Revolution Muslim" is a group run by undercover FBI agents who are trying to and apprehend extremist Muslims in New York and foil terrorist attacks. The FBI has publically admitted to creating and running white supremacist and militas groups in the United States. In the 1990s the FBI infiltrated milita groups to foil domestic terrorist plots. And I'm not saying the FBI is wrong for doing this..it is quite effective. "Revolution Muslim" just doesn't seem like a real group to me.
No, these guys are for real. I know someone who knows them. These guys know practically nothing about Islam or Christianity, and yet they're willing to lay down their lives for something they know nothing about. It's a matter of time before they commit an act of terrorism.
I just see pure BLIND faith with the ppl at Revolution Muslim
Did Mr. Abdel Malik refuse to debate you?
If at all possible, when and where will you be debating Mr. Abdel-Malik?
Sadiq is pretty difficult to work with. He's constantly calling people names, complaining, and yelling, but I'd be happy to debate him again. I suggest the topic:
"Who Was Muhammad?"
To even things out, we could add a second debate:
"Who Was Jesus?"
Those are, after all, the main questions before us.
I should note, however, that I seriously doubt Sadiq would ever defend Muhammad in a public debate. Some Muslims simply want to attack Christianity, and Sadiq seems to be in this camp.
Can you produce any evidence that Mr. Abdel-Malik has called people names during his debates or used any inappropriate language during his dialogues with you or your colleagues at ABN?
I wouldn't mind you and Mr. Abdel-Malik debating on any subject, but don't you think that it has been done so many times already? Why not use 'War and Genocide in the Bible and the Qur'an: A Comparitive Study' as a topic for debate? I don't think that I've seen this debate topic before and it would be something different than many of the debate topics we have already seen.
Thank You, Yusuf
I believe Revolution Muslim uses the term 'Sheikh' towards Mr. Abdel-Malik as an arabic term of respect and endearment because he is an elderly man amongst their ranks. This is a custom not uncommon amongst Muslims or Arabs. From what I can see, the young men of Revolution Muslim love Mr. Abdel-Malik as an one of us would (and should) love and respect our elders.
Sadiq called in to ABN and called us cowards. Apart from this, I have two phone messages stored in which he refers to Pastor Joseph (a personal friend of mine) as "Pastor Jerkoff."
Needless to say, this is extremely offensive, and it's difficult to work with people who use such language.
The topic you suggested is typically incorporated into "Peace and Violence" debates, and there have been a ton of these (many have been posted on this very blog).
While there have been many debates on the identity of Jesus, and a few debates on the Prophethood of Muhammad, there have been no such debates between me and Sadiq. Additionally, since these are the major areas of disagreement between Christians and Muslims, we should debate them regularly.
Of course, if Sadiq isn't willing, that's fine. But he shouldn't pretend he's ready for public debate if he's not ready to defend his prophet and refute our views about Jesus. Sam, Nabeel, and I are ready any time. Tell Sadiq to contact us when he's ready.
It is disappointing to hear about this.
I can understand how such name calling would naturally cause offense and possibly escalate into further conflict.
Similarly, it makes sense that it would be difficult to work towards discussion or dialog with anyone under those circumstances.
Inshah'alaa Ta'alaa, I will convey your feelings to Mr. Abdel-Malik.
There will be no escalation on this end.
Sadiq also refers to my friend Sam Shamoun as "Sham Baboon."
But there isn't much I can do about this except ignore the insults.
I have just spoken to Mr. Abdel-Malik and conveyed your feelings on the issue to him.
Mr. Abdel-Malik regretfully admits to using some of those insults in his posts and in calls he has left on your voicemail.
However, Mr. Abdel-Malik denies calling you or your colleagues at ABN any names in a televised media forum of any kind.
He has relayed to me that he called you three times and left messages on December 19th immediately following your first response to my topic suggestion.
I find this situation disturbing to say the least.
Undoubtedly, I am left with the question, 'What would Prophet Muhammad Ibn Abdullah Salallahu Alayhee Wa Salaam do?'
Inshahalaa Ta'alaa, Tonight I will review the Sunnah and I pray that Allah Subhana Wa Ta'alaa guide all of us in this matter so that it can be resolved in a manner that reflects the best teachings of Moses, Jesus, and Muhammad (Peace and Blessings Be Upon Them). Ameen.
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