WINNING DEBATES FOR DUMMIES: A Guide for Muslims to Win Debates with Ten Easy Tricks
1. Always keep your CAPS Lock on. This way your post will be difficult to read and no one will be able to answer.
2. Whenever someone comes up with a verse from the Quran that you are unable to defend, say that it is taken out of CONTEXT.
3. Whenever someone comes up with a Hadith that you are unable to answer, say that Hadiths are not reliable.
4. When someone comes to you with both the Quran and the Hadith, say that the Quran and the Hadith can only be understood in Arabic.
5. When someone comes to you with the Quran and the Hadith and also proves that he/she understands Arabic, say that these verses are for a specific time period and could not be applied today.
6. When you cannot answer any questions, say that Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world and soon the entire world will believe.
7. When someone comes up with proofs that Islam is not the fastest growing religion, say that these figures are biased and compiled by Christians.
8. Paste some YouTube videos about the Quran's scientific miracles. When someone proves that these videos are stupid, shout that they are biased.
9. Keep on pasting random verses from the Quran to divert attention.
10. Finally, when you are totally on the run, curse and threaten people with Hell fire and say that they are not worthy of Islam.
Monday, October 31, 2011
Muslim Debate Tricks
In the comments section, Yohannes posted ten rules of Muslim debate. Since we see these tricks being implemented again and again, they deserve special attention.
There is humor in what you say, but a sense of reality too.
I tend to agree with those tricks being the Muslim's ammo.
From being a Christian, I see Muslim's tactics and attitudes toward criticism as being born by some evil spirit. It is very difficult to comprehend that such a great amount of people belonging to the same religion can be so thwarted in their reasoning and rationality. It is not as if they all come from one specific group and culture either. There must be some kind of spirit at work in their lives to cause them to behave this way. There has to be something like that going on. It is as if they are conspiring to behave the way they do. I know that this is heading off topic; but, I wanted to mention it because of another post.
I would like to mention that this is true only in countries that Islam don't control ...
The preferred method in Islamic countries is killing anyone who will question Islam/Mohammed ...
This include Muslims whom question Islam/Mohammed too ...
Here is an example Fr. Zakaria from Egypt
Anyone wants to see and hear what Islam is ... check how minority are treated under Islamic occupation ...
I'm surprised you forgot an 11th tactic: comment on practices by other religions, post videos of actions by people in that religion or verses from their scripture all in order to make that religion seem bad (and thus to deflect from Islam) Post videos.
seems more like politics ...
deny deny deny.
From now on, we should give this list to Muslims before any debate.
Well, there is trick 11, and that is to never reply back at all.
With a bit of rewording, many of these are guidelines for Internet atheists, too. One actually said, "Atheism is the fastest growing religion in the world!" That statement is wrong on many levels.
A guy on youtube just did what you said:
He said the hadiths might be unreliable when I quoted ones from this site on rape of captured women.
It's a waste of time debating with them most of the time. "Pearls before swine...".
I usually preface a debate with Muslims that they will eventually deny the teachings and sunna of Allah, Mohamed, and their scholars. And then after a couple of comments i point out exactly where and how they did it. And then the threaten or attack me and my family, mostly my Mother.
Don't forget the ultimate Refutation of Muslims...
"Your butt stinks"....
May Alah curse you camel with weak urinre
Great post Davie
(A few more that I could think of..)
11. Throw platitudes such as "Islam is a religion of peace", "Men and woman have equal rights in Islam", "There is no compulsion in Islam". Good thing you don't have to provide any evidence for these statements.
12. Use conjecture and guesswork to prove your case. Good thing again, that you don't have to provide any references to the Hadiths or respected Islamic commentaries!
13. Attack Christianity! You can pick any random point that you can remember. It need not be related to the issue at hand and there is no need to know anything about the matter. Just pick up an argument that you found online on some Muslim websites.
14. Jump to another topic.
15. Claim victory even if you are badly beaten in the argument!
16. If nothing works revert to personal attacks. Call people bigots and islamophobes! Throw insults such as "female dog in heat". Swearing is allowed. And don't forget to blame the Jew!!!
17. Even if that doesn't help issue anonymous threats. If you don't want to bother with any of the above tricks make this your first and single option.
Allah knows best.
A moslem has asked me to prove that the scientific knowledge about the universe expanding was already widespread before the 6th century. The moslem contends that Mohammad was the one that first predicted that the universe is expanding and on that basis therefore it is a miracle in the quran. I disputed that and said I will bring my proof today.
I have found a source to prove my point but does anyone know of other sources that will bolster my argument even stronger ?
12th trick is miss the flight
I always get you have to speak Arabic to understand the true meaning, because the translation is incorrect - (Well then why did they translate it that way?)
I don't believe the hadiths. If it is not in the Quran it is not true - (Praying 5 times a day is in the hadiths not in the Quran and how would you know who some people are?)
If it contradicts the Quran the hadith is not true - (But it doesn't contradict the Quran. It is not in the Quran at all)
You got that from some "Christian Missionary" source like Answering-Islam.org. You are copying and pasting from a 'hate site' - (Yet see my response from Answering-Christianity and Muthdith.org)
taomeano said: "The moslem contends that Mohammad was the one that first predicted that the universe is expanding and on that basis therefore it is a miracle in the quran."
You should first challenge him on whether the Qur'an says that the universe is expanding.
Well... one more tactic was left out: Instead of even considering to address your objections to Islam they just ignore them and turn around and attack some unrelated tenants of the Christian faith in a textbook example of the famous " tu quoque" fallacy!
Oh and of course after all fails if you are a woman they just start to hurl really disgusting sexual slurs and rape threats at you and if you are a man they threaten to find out were you live and come and kill you and rape your wife and kids!
These rape and murder threats have happened to me many times even on cyber spaces like on the comment forum of YouTube videos! It is really amazing and funny how shameless and stupid these Muslims can be to post such violent and disgusting comments at the end of a tooth and nail argument to prove to everyone that Islam is the "religion of peace"! Kind of gives their game away, doesn't it!!!?
A few more:
11. Claim that Christianity has the same fallacies... (which at best proves that both are wrong and not prove that Islam is right)
12. Jump topics... they always remind me of a jackrabbit.
13. Like a dishonest skeptic, ask question after question after question... paying no attention to the answers provided... u miss a single one and they go "Hey, told u... Islam is right"
Great work David..
Allah knows Arabic and he is best deceiver
But Allah is the very best deceiver/schemer/trickster. Qur'an 3:54; 8:30; 10:21/22
Great job David God Bless all of you, Peace.
21.... Quote as many random quranic verses as you can in one breadth to confuse the opponent (even if the verses have nothing to do with the topic at hand. I have seen Dr. Zakir Naik quote verses left and right though they have nothing to do with the topic he is discussing.)
22...Quote the Bible to prove Mohammad is a true prophet (even though the verses have nothing to do with Mohammad).
23.... Find any word in the Bible that rhyms with Mohammad and use that verse to prove that Mohammad is a true prophet. (Regardless of the fact the verse is talking about something else).
24.... Keep saying that the Bible is corrupt (with out any logic or reason) to prove Mohammad is right.
25.... Audience should interupt the Oponent debator by shouting Alah Oh Akbar repeatedly to try to confuse him.
26.... If nothing else works, start burning churches all over the world and start killing christians to prove Mohammad is a true prophet and Islam is a religion of peace.
Well, you can also say that the Bible is predicting that the universe is expanding:
"It is He (God) who sits above the circle of the earth, and its inhabitants are like grasshoppers, Who stretches out the heavens like a curtain, and SPREADS THEM OUT like a tent to dwell in." Isaiah 40:22
"Bless the Lord, O my soul! O Lord my God, You are very great: You are clothed with honor and majesty, who cover Yourself with light as with a garment, who STRETCH OUT the heavens like a curtain." Psalm 104:1-2
As I said in a previous comment, with a bit of imagination you can find "miracles" everywhere.
Why debate someone when you can just take out your sword and chop off their head. It's just so much easier.
Yeah, those 10 are pretty much it. Although, aside from debate, these days it's just easier to label us as Islamophobic racists.
Did everyone see what's happening over at Atlas shrugged and Pam.
Thought I would share a link to Dan Dennett and his talk on Memes and Toxic ideas. He goes from ants and brain flukes to Islam, Catholicism, Capitalism and Communism.
Toxic Ideas... Dangerous Memes:
Oh great one i had one a few months back. i had a debate with a seriosly unintelligent muslim, using some of sam shamoun stuff and he still doesn;t get the trinity and saying it was 3 gods over again despite me giving him the logical answers. then he says all west is chrsitians and accuse us of sexual immoral due to porn sites. yeah right then goes to attack priest that was accused of being pervs even though i explained to him not all christians are true christians. then threatens me about hell again and again saying i got my bed booked in it. i pretty much used his own documentary logic against him about old palestine bible. because the addresser said it never mention virgin birth from mary and then and never mention jesus was god(which he claims support islam) in relation to one another.he accused the discples of lying and tried to used the numbers 31 :35-40 claiming it was from the bible about 3 year olds sex. I explained the tahmud because he claimed older versions of the bible had it but i checked and there was none. i pretty much blocked him after our muta discussion because as i said started about people who claim that they christians and do bad things. deleted him completely and the the final discussion of mutah. he accused the disciples wanting power, my reply was that they were all persecuted so they they just get followers to have their heads taken off
in the rebutting 1mm /introduction to logical fallacy, I encounter a similar muslim tactic from a ********
I don't write his name here out of respect, but all alarms go off since the tactics are too damn similar.
He showed up with a belief of "a concept" which is not a religion, and I thought that's fine.
Then his rambling goes everywhere from topic A to topic Z. Questions pop up every time and made no effort to solve one matter but then justify whatever he said and moves on to other topics.
Plus, trying to justify everything the guy said on his own, in fact believing in such unfounded facts.
i.e. If I say that I don't believe in Santa Claus the guy would rebutted me just in spite of.
Even if I ask for evidence, he just throw in a link or two, thinking that I wasn't going to read em anyway. In fact I did. And also pointed back that the links not only have no-relation at all, but clearly deny his point.
So I will propose a tactic no 11, hmm make that no 100 or so.
100. Claiming to be somebody else, or a wolf wearing a wool coat and yelling "baaaaaaaaaaa".
I bet you all thought I was making up the "Your butt stinks" argument from muslims.
Well here you go
THECROSSLEADSTOHELL: u dont know how to clean ur selves when u go to the toilet ur religion is a dirty religion
oh my God! David you nailed this one on the right spot!! I've always talked with Muslims about the Quran (and Arabic is my first language). Those reasons are exactly what Muslims do when they are cornered. I love this post.
As some of you probably know I live in a muslim country.
Let's see 3 extra tactics that WORKS ONLY in a muslim's nation without even the slightest freedom of speech.
1. Accusing the Christian of being other faith or non faith.
i.e. Calling you "atheist" or "satan spawn" if you don't believe in their Allah. Because according to them, Christian God and Muslim's God are ONE. (there's a sura about it).
Prognosis: you could end up in a situation where everyone seems so excited about sending their "flying" shoes to your face.
2. Accusing you of defaming or disrespecting Islam directly (without considering the basis of the debate) therefor you will have to answer to the local authority afterwards.
Prognosis: even worse, but then again who in the right mind want to do a Christian Muslim debate in a non-free speech nation?
Unless they were talking about which one of the muppets that looks more like a Christian or a muslim.
3. Their frequent use of "Mashyallah" "Nauzubillah" and everything that seems mocking to those who understand what it means.
Remember, they see if you actually understand by the expression you show, therefore if a debate is in english, the muslim apologist knows instantly if you are able or not reading arabic.
Prognosis: you can bet they will accuse you of "fabricating" your facts anyway. Son of a gun! (borrowing that Pastor Joseph's word)
Some Christian apologists may use the same tactics, but again this is the "dirty harry"-look /poker face kinda warfare.
A related topic - "10 Common Logical Fallacies Made By Muslims" by Robert A. Morey (David, maybe you can post this?)
Christians must be prepared to answer the typical objections made against the Gospel. Most of the objections are based on simple logical fallacies. The following is a list of some of the most common fallacies used by Muslims.
Note: The average Muslim does not know that his arguments are logically erroneous. He is sincere in his beliefs. Thus you must be patient and kind in sharing with him why his arguments are invalid.
1. The Fallacy of False Assumptions: In logic as well as in law, "historical precedent" means that the burden of proof rests on those who set forth new theories and not on those whose ideas have already been verified. The old tests the new. The already established authority judges any new claims to authority.
Since Islam came along many centuries after Christianity, Islam has the burden of proof and not Christianity. The Bible tests and judges the Qur'an. When the Bible and The Qur'an contradict each other, the Bible must logically be given first place as the older authority. The Qur'an is in error until it proves itself.
Some Muslims violate the principle of historical precedent by asserting that Islam does not have the burden of proof and that the Qur'an judges the Bible.
2. Arguing in a circle: If you have already assumed in your premise what you are going to state in your conclusion, then you have ended where you began and proven nothing....
(Read more: http://bit.ly/dUvhzc )
I believe all religion is flawed at best, because God is so big and we are so small. Any attempt to distill God down into a single book of scripture is misguided. When we come to love the book more than we love God, or God's children, is that not just another form of idolatry?
When we come to love religion more that we love God, we have to start finding ways to justify ourselves. God needs no justification. Religion demands to be justified, then worshipped and then proclaimed to be Law. Then begins the battles, large and small. Arguing or debating religion with anyone is profoundly stupid. It never leads to tolerance, respect or peace. It always leads to conflict.
I am Muslim and I am often deeply ashamed of the things other Muslims do. But no more so than I am ashamed of humanity as a whole. I personally would not want to live in a Muslim country. I would not like to live in a Christian, Jewish, Hindi state either. I like being American, I like diversity, and I like separation of church and state.
The God that I bow down to five times a day is A God of peace and forgiveness, not a god of hate and war.
May Allah's peace and blessing be upon you
why are you guys? debate with Muslims there certain tricks?
i want to start debate with one muslim and he asked me to introduce bible first because he told me that bible is not word of GOD
There are those who will vehemently defend the inerrancy of the Word of God. Christians was deceive that bible is word from God and they completely ignore HOW it was compiled, filtered, put together and named by pagans!
The Council of Nicea in 325 in Rome DECIDED for christians what books would be included and what would be official church doctrine. Constantine the empror of rome was the ultimate approver or disprover of word of God, not a Spirit led born again believer in Jesus! Most will claim Constantine was a believer, what they don't tell you is that Constantine didn't convert until he was on his deathbed! Which means the early church majority did nothing as a pagan compiled and Told US what doctrine was true or false! thats how they change word of God from torah to Bible. while The Torah states that all mitzvot remain binding forever, and anyone coming to change the Torah is immediately identified as a false prophet. (Deut. 13:1-4).
Since the Council of Nicea had absolutely nothing to do with the text of the Bible, anyone who talks about the Council in connection with the text of the Bible has absolutely no clue what he's talking about. I wish Muslims would be more interested in doing some actual research than in spouting total nonsense!
The council of Nice a did decide on certain theological issues, including the divinity of Christ. That has a pretty huge influence on the text of the bible. Certain things were later cut or added, certain words changed or removed.
How to recognize someone who has no clue what he's talking about. He says something like this:
"The council of Nice a did decide on certain theological issues, including the divinity of Christ. That has a pretty huge influence on the text of the bible. Certain things were later cut or added, certain words changed or removed."
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