Saturday, December 19, 2009

New Year's Resolution for Muslims in Indonesia: "Destroy More Churches in 2010"

I Triple-Dog-Dare Muslims to say that this has nothing to do with Islam.

Jakarta (AsiaNews) – Last night a crowd of angry Muslims, including women and children, attacked the Church of Saint Albert, in Bekasi Regency, about 30 kilometres east of Jakarta. The situation is now under control but the local Catholic community is afraid of an escalation before Christmas.
Kurniadi is a member of the committee charged with the church’s construction. He told AsiaNews, “Suddenly, a bunch of bikers arrived in the area where the church stands.” They had banners and kerosene tanks. “We don’t know why we were attacked,” he said.

Kristina Maria Renteana, who was present when the Church was attacked, said, “The mob had about a thousand people,” not only men, but “women and children” as well.

Running around in cars and motorbikes is a tradition for Indonesian Muslims during “national celebrations.”

Last night was the first day of the Islamic New Year, the start of the month of Muharram. Local sources told AsiaNews, on condition of anonymity, that the “crowd was made of people from Tarumajaya and Babelan”, two villages in North Bekasi where Islamic extremists are a majority.

Saint Albert’s Church, a chapel that is part of Saint Arnold’ Church in Bekasi, was not yet finished. Started on 11 May 2008, it had the required building permit for places of worship and was 80 per cent complete. Workers had finished the walls and the roof. Only ceramic floor tiles had to be laid.

Although not yet finished, it was set to host Christmas Mass for the local Christian community.

Now it is damaged but police and government authorities have urged the parish priest, Fr Joseph Jagadwa, to go ahead with the Mass anyway. Source.


MaMiKiKeYu said...

This is from my country, Im so sad about it.

MaMiKiKeYu said...

This is from my country, Im so sad about it.

Apollos26 said...

I'm boiling inside, reading this. Really don't know how far I should my anger let.

The first thing that came into my mind was:

Sending mercenaries their, like in John Rambo!

Talking about islam, you will never hear/see thiese things on television.

The problem is, that not every person understands the difficulty of the teachings of islam and not handling it in an accurate and save way, a type of hatred and antiislamism (comparison: antisemitism in the third reich) could evolve. Of course the BIIIIIIIG difference is, that promoting information abut islam, can't be compared to the disgusting nazipropaganda.

But what could be the best way to alert and to inform people without causing riots?

A thing that comforts me alway is, that our God is sovereign. It is all in HIS hands and we can trust HIM that HE will make everything NEW.

God bless you all dear brothers and sisters in Christ and let us pray for our persecuted brothers and sisters in the world, that God will strengthen them and will give them the victory over their enemies.

In Jesus Christ,


Radical Moderate said...

The family that Jihads together stays togther.

"Kristina Maria Renteana, who was present when the Church was attacked, said, “The mob had about a thousand people,” not only men, but “women and children” as well."

Sepher Shalom said...

To Mr./Mrs./Ms. "Unknown":

Matt. 5:11-12 “Blessed are you when people insult you and persecute you, and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of Me. Rejoice and be glad, for your reward in heaven is great; for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you."

Romans 8:35-39 Who will separate us from the love of Christ? Will tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? Just as it is written, “FOR YOUR SAKE WE ARE BEING PUT TO DEATH ALL DAY LONG; WE WERE CONSIDERED AS SHEEP TO BE SLAUGHTERED.” But in all these things we overwhelmingly conquer through Him who loved us. For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

My prayers are with you.

ned said...

It is really scary for the Christians who live those aggressive places. Such a thing may be just the beginning of what we may see in other countries. Even a threat of this magnitude is horrifying but where ever we are our Stronghold is in God Who alone is our Rock and Saviour. I would like to mention some verses from Book of Revelation, chapter 2 12"To the angel of the church in Pergamum write: "These are the words of Him who has the sharp, double-edged sword. 13 I know where you live—where Satan has his throne. Yet you remain true to my name. You did not renounce your faith in me, even in the days of Antipas, my faithful witness, who was put to death in your city—where Satan lives.
According to Jesus persecution will come and all we should pray that God be with our brothers and sister in Christ so that their faith soars to higher levels during this time. At the same time we should pray for muslims so that God would change their hearts to Christ. I am not angry on this resolution cause these things have to happen for Christ name sake but surely my heart and prayers go out for our brothers and sisters.

Phyllis Blickensderfer said...

Muslims have done unto others and expect the same in return. They cannot understand:

Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
(Matthew 5:43-44 KJV)

Adam said...

Ignorant America Ignorant Americans
Sikh youth brutally assaulted in US

Ignorant Americans cant indentify a Sikh, Jews, Christians, Zoroastrians, Hindus etc.. How will they identify the real Ones. This not the first attack on Sikh in USA. Sikhs are mistaken by ignorant Americans as Taliban. Or I think American pretend to be ignorant cos they have no Guts to face the EVIL ones… Cos the Kaaba Worshipper’s revenge could bring a fatal disaster on their white skin.

Hogan Elijah Hagbard said...

I would suggest you all do some google research about the persecutions in Indonesia in 1999-2000.

These were really dreadful persecutions and claimed the lives of some 10.000 Christians including the burning of several towns and villages.

The air ports even organised welcome tables in some locations to welcome Muslims from other nations to come specifically and hunt down Christians.

At that time the worldwide media made the typical choice to remain political correct and present Islam as a peaceful religion by supressing the news (talk about madness and lies).

Finally when 10-20.000 Christians were about to be killed in one single night the international forces intervened and the media informed the world not of Islamic genocide of Christians but of tribal clashes (so much for our secular community).

It is a fact that should matters get out of hand again in Indonesia the Christians there pretty much are dependent upon the Christian society in the West to expose the truth to the worldwide community.

Unknown said...

You know what is just as sad as this....if islam was a true religion of peace...the self proclaimed westernized moderate muslims would take to the streets and tell the so called extremists (i like calling them extremly devout) to stop damaging the name of islam..... would Allah not move them in such a way to stand up to this? or is this how thier religion truely is? Most of you know the answer but for the self proclaimed moderates out there.....look into the light and see the answer.

Yet another proof that islam is not a religion of peace

Radical Moderate said...

Hogan Elijah Hagbard Do u have any books, news articles, or even UN reports?

Fernando said...

Hi brother The Fat Man... ytou can ask those date from

pick up theire email and writte to them... they are a Catholic organization, butt they are helping, withoute any efford off prozelitation, all Christian denominations...

Jon said...

Apollos26 is a good example of the type of violence that David Wood and others engender here with their fear mongering. It's hard to identify a cultural group subjected to more oppression than Muslims in the world right now. Bombs falling all round them. Starvation in Palestine, Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan. These are huge atrocities. David Wood will comb the news to find these wrongs that are committed by Muslims, which frankly are nits compared to the death and destruction being reigned down in Pakistan right now. And Barack Obama will love it, because the effect of this propaganda is to divert attention from his huge war crimes and if anything encourage him to engage in more.

Rest assured, Apollos26, that there are many mercenaries throughout the world slaughtering Muslims as we speak, making the destruction of this church (which is truly awful) look small.

For you guys it's a religious war. Not for Barack Obama and George Bush though. For them it's the finances. Their backers have a huge stake in this region of the world, which is among the wealthiest in natural resources. But the propaganda here provides them with the cover they need to continue to plunder. Stalin would call you guys "useful idiots." You fight his wars for him, both literally with many evangelicals joining the army, and the propaganda war, which occurs at this website. You can endure the costs while others will reap the rewards.

Apollos26, the scale of atrocities committed against Muslims by the U.S. government is so much greater than what happened in Indonesia. Do you boil inside due to that? Or is it the case that you only care about wrongs committed against people of a certain faith and the rest don't matter?

Fernando said...

Jon, allways glade to pointe the obvious saide: «the scale of atrocities committed against muslims by the U.S. government is so much greater than what happened in Indonesia»...

Jon, allways glade not to pointe whate is also obvious did nott saide: «the atrocities commited by the U.S. is nott only inflicted unto muslims (butt why is thate it seams thate Jon is only worried aboutte muslims?) and are due to political (and therefore reformable) reasons, butt the atrocities commited by muslims to everione (extra and intra-muslim violence) are due to religious principles thate, according to muslim core sources, are irreformable»...

Jon said...

I don't agree, Fernando, that religions are not reformable. The Roman Catholic church was once a slave endorsing, brutal institution. And obviously the bible is very much in support of slavery. The institution can change despite it's foundational texts. Islam can. But the fundamentalist branch of Islam is gaining right now. What are the causes of that? I think they're important to consider.

And I don't think the Iraqi child that is starved to death due to the imperial ambitions of the U.S. government is comforted to know that her death has politics at the root rather than religion.

Fernando said...

Hi Jon...

you saide: «the Bible is very much in support of slavery»...

coulde you exemplify this claim? thanks...

you also saide: «The Roman Catholic church was once a slave endorsing, brutal institution»...

coulde you exemplify this claim? thanks...

I did not saide religions were mot reformable; I saide islam is not reformable... sorry iff my english is not still good to you... here whate I saide: «(...) are due to religious principles thate, according to muslim core sources, are irreformable»... whithe the text in stronger black I hope my english is better understood...

The problem, Jon, is thate the intrinsic compreension off the Biblical texts (an historical religion) allowed thate "reformation" or "renovation" thate was, as a matter off fact, a return to the Biblical message thate was circunstationaly overruuled bu wordly questions;

on the other hand, Jon, the intrinsic message off teh qur'an and the hadiths (and remember thate islam is a an-historical religion) does nott allow thate kind off reformation; on the other hand, any "refformation" or "renovation" in the present islam thate woulde be analogous to whate happened in Christianity woulde bring muslims to an eben fundamentalist religion since the muslim key texts are like thate...

marry Christmans to you Jon and you entire familie... God bless...

chrisse said...

Jon says : "The Roman Catholic church was once a slave endorsing, brutal institution.

1. It is the Catholic Church, so named in the first century to differentiate the true Christians from the heretics that arose around them who were also calling themselves "Christians" (some things never change). While "Roman" can be applied when referring to the Church of Rome specific to that Church, when making a reference to the whole, it is the Catholic Church. So, for example, I am a Catholic, Latin Rite. I am not a member of the Church of Rome, my Church is in Australia. I understand it can get confusing, but when making accusations as you did, it would be better that you displayed at least a modicum of knowledge and intellect in doing so.

Your use of the words "Roman Catholic Church" is a wording used by the perpetually protesting and reforming to insult Christ's Church.

2. The Catholic Church had rid the Holy Roman Empire of slavery by the 10th Century. Now, while it can be argued that serfdom is a form of slavery, (just as working for an employer can also be argued as a form of slavery), it was not "slavery" in the sense of islamic slavery. Serfdom was one of the steps in the development of our civilisation, such development having as it's foundation the Catholic Church's theology and philosophy. She did not, could not (if you know history, you'll know it wasn't that simple), force anything but instead stood firm against those whose purpose was to destroy Christ's Church.

3. I'll give you two examples briefly explained. After 700 years of islamic oppression, in an islamic culture of slavery, the Portuguese did enslave (against the Catholic Church's orders). Unfortunately, the stench of islamic culture is particularly difficult to cleanse from the system. My second example, is the US Catholic Bishops ignored the specific teaching that slavery was wrong, and all slaves were free and to be freed. (They chose to interpret the instruction as meaning not to enslave, and pretend it didn't mean to also free those already enslaved - a particular group of Catholic Bishops ignoring the Pope, again - some things never change).

4. It is well past the time that regurgitating post-Luther/Henry VIII/"Enlightenment" slanders and libels against the Church does anything but show the person so doing as a bigot and ignorant.

I assume that you have simply picked up on the common anti-Catholic bigotry and revisionist history that started with Luther and Henry VIII.

I love and embrace the Catholic Church and all her members - the good, the bad, the brilliant, the despicable. I will not denounce any as not Christian, but leave that judgement to Christ alone. I will, however, look at Her brilliant history (the good, the bad, the brilliant, the despicable) with an open mind so that history's lessons can be learned.

Three examples of common ignorance and bigotry are the "historical narrative" about Galileo, the Inquisitions, and that improperly named "Reformation". So please, try and control your urge to regurgitate these (and other) myths in this discussion.

Apollos26 said...


I am very bored by dumb comments.

Did I say that there should be mercenaries going around and killing muslims? - Nope, so don't put words on the blog which I never wrote down.

Every attrocity should be punished!

Did I talk about america? - Nope, so why are you going political? I am not interested at all in politics, here it is all about theology.

Jon said...

Fernando, you can get a good summary of the biblical stance on slavery here. For the brutality of the Roman Catholic Church just look into the Crusades and Inquisitions. Support for slavery amongst the Roman Catholic hierarchy is pretty obvious, though I will grant that some Pope's have acted in commendable ways. Whether Christianity is "reformable" sort of depends on which Christian you talk with. Some think the Biblical mandates are the gold standard and cannot be changed. I imagine it's the same with Islam, but even if it isn't at present why couldn't it be in the future?

Jon said...

I understand it can get confusing, but when making accusations as you did, it would be better that you displayed at least a modicum of knowledge and intellect in doing so.

In fact my words are not coming from a position of ignorance but from a position that "Roman" is a more appropriate designation for what is often called the "Catholic" church. I'm no longer a Protestant. I once was. When I was I thought that words mattered. "Catholic" means "universal" and I didn't regard the Roman Catholic as correct theologically, so why should I allow them to claim that they are in fact the universal church, which by implication would suggest that I as a Protestant am not? In older Roman Catholic literature RC's such as Cardinal Newman were content to refer to themselves as "Papists" and their religion "Popery". Now in later times with the Pope given an even more prominent place than he once had somehow this has come to be thought of as offensive. I'm willing to accomodate that out of charity, but I see no reason to go a step further and grant the particular Roman Catholic denomination the title of "Universal Church".

I can grant the Roman Catholic Church some credit on the issue of slavery. They have in some cases acted honorably despite their holy text, which clearly endorses slavery. This is my point though. The dogmatic foundational texts may suggest that slavery is perpetual, but the religion still manages to reform itself. Why can't Islam do that as well?

I wonder if perhaps it is you that is ignorant of such issues as the Inquisitions and Galileo. See my own summary of the events concerning Galileo here.

Billy Mcquirer said...

It's so sad to see the level of hate that Christians have for Islam. Take cases from areas where cultural tradition is in play more so than the religion. God forbids if the people in the story have Muslim/ Islamic names. Then their behavior becomes an indictment against an entire religion. What about what we do here and abroad. With Christian names, but yet we as muslims never accuse the entire faith. Jeffrey Dommer, John, Jonathan, Chris,Paul, etc. etc. There are 100's of Christians with traditional Christian names committing crimes every single day. Why aren't muslim blaming Christians for the crimes in this country,95% of the prison population are people that claim Christianity as their faith or that they grew up with those values and beliefs.Yet Muslims are able to recognize the difference between a crazh misguided person over a true Christian. Keep preaching hate and intolerance it only pushes people away from Christianity. After 911so many people came to islam behind hate speeches and negative articles. We we actually surprise to see that increase in numbers. The hate was so high that many Muslims hide their islam. Sites like this shows me the hate is still there. And yes you are right, there are a lot of verses in the Bible thay are worse tham the ones you mention from the Quran.

David Wood said...


Do you really not see the difference between (1) people not condemning Christianity for the actions of an atheist like Jeffrey Dahmer, and (2) people condemning Islam because it commands the violent actions of Muslim terrorists?

If you don't see the difference, it seems you lack the "logic" gene.

Billy Mcquirer said...

Jeffrey Dommer and Timothy Mcvay, claim christianity as their faith. Timothy sister was the only one who spoke on his behalf and she mentioned his Christian up bring. If you were to give an outrageous number of so called Muslim terrorist as 100 million. That would only represent less than 7% of the Mualim population. Think before you speak is all I'm saying.

David Wood said...

If you're just going to lie, go somewhere else. Jeffrey Dahmer said on an interview on NBC Dateline that he had always believed that we "came from the slime" and that "after death, there's nothing." And you call that Christianity? Similarly, McVeigh (which you couldn't even spell) called his religion "science." He was an agnostic.

So your examples of Christian terrorists are an atheist and an agnostic? And you compare this to Muslims shouting "Allahu Akbar," quoting the Qur'an, and committing their acts in the name of Allah? Sheer deception and desperation. Go somewhere else with your nonsense.